Which Asian country do you predict will have the best navy in 2020?
This is just a fun poll so please vote.

The Maldives!!!

China because it wants it, and it could afford it. Japan by 2020 will be so mired in debt, low GDP growth, and pension payments it can't keep up.

South Korea will have the best navy, their economy will grow if war breaks out between North Korea and UN forces soon, by the time they rebuild, they will become a great power. If they continue to keep close relations w/ the US they can get a lot of American ships and might have get the capability to manufacture many stealth ships!

its between china and japan really

first of all, its quality and numbers
but i assume you are asking which one will dominate

all nations seem like they will stay in their areas, except china
with china buildup, they are predict by us navy analysts to have 50 modern submarines (augusta 90b standard or better) by 2010, while japan will probably stay with its 18 modern submarines

the third in this race is india, after india it does not matter because everyone else including pakistan wiull be playing defensive for the most part

seondly, it all depends on if china takes taiwan now and reduces its buildup or keeps on going the way it does right now, which everone expects

in terms of quantity, we all expect china to become the largest (they are making 70 naval vessels annually )

if you are talking about quality, it depends on if the EU ban is lifter before 2012-2014 so china can utilize the technology from them and upgrade her ships

if the ban is not lifted, then by 2020 china and japn will be tied, if the ban is lifted before 2012, china will be ahead by alot, and if the ban is lifted after 2012, china will have a narrow lead

ISI:

All your calculations seemed to be based on Japan keeping its present level of defense spending. However, I predict that by 2010 Japan will have increased its military spending (in part due to internal pressure and in part due to US pressure to balance out China). So in 2010, the Japanese will still be way ahead of the CHinese.

Y do u have bhindian navy option in the poll...i suggest it be excluded from the poll.

would the bhindians on bharat ratshit have "pakistan"as an option?

will have the best navy in 2020.

2012 onwards IN will be the largest Carrier Group in Asian waters, apart from the USN ofcourse/ The real answer is that even in Asia USN will be by far the greatest navy, followed by India and Japan. Chinese doctrine just does not provide for a strong navy. They'll have strong firepower, but will hardly be blue water capable.

J ust wondering wat will pakistans navy be like in 2020

Well, that's because India is indigenously building a 37, 500 ton aircraft carrier! Does China or Japan make carriers? No, right? So India deserves to be in the poll because India has superpower ambitions like China. But China has a lead over all Asian countries' navy because it indigenously makes SSNs, SSBNs, DDGs and FFGs.

It's only a matter of time before China indigenously makes its own CVs and CVNs.

As for South Korea's Navy, they will be getting three Aegis KDX-III DDGs by 2010, and they may get USA's DDG(X) before 2020. However, China's PLAN will probably have 8-12 Type 052C DDGs and 6-12 Type 051C DDGs by 2020, not mentioning future improved Chinese DDGs with stealth capabilities and advanced Phased Array Radar. So, in terms of quantity and quality, China's Navy should be No.1 or No.2 among Asian navies in 2020( The US Navy is not an Asian navy, although it operates in Asia because USA is a North American country ).

IMHO I think the Japanese Navy is the Asian navy that will probably pose a threat to China's PLAN, while the Indian Navy is improving their AAW and ASW capabilities to make their CVBGs more lethal. India might also be indigenously making their own SSNs and SSKs before 2020. So, China should get a carrier or two before 2020, because China's DDG and SSN capabilities are way ahead of the Indian Navy.

The Maldives is not even in the Top 20 List of Asian Navies.

By 2020, PLAN will be a pretty good regional force, but Japan and Korea would be more worried about Chinese submarine fleet rather than their surface forces. The concentration of attack fighters and patrol crafts with anti-ship missile capabilities are pretty dense. Japan has close to 70 P-3C (up to 4 Harpoons) and the projected P-X, as well as 100 F-2A/B (2 ASM-2 per plane) and probably a twin-engined attack fighter (FA-18E/F? 4 missiles per plane) to deliver the blows. South Korea is armed with up to a dozen P-3Cs, with all the top frontline fighters tweaked with anti-ship missile capability. China of course has a dedicated squadron of Su-30MKKs for the job as well. I think you should look at the future sub-surface acquisitions of these nations.

ever heard of sarcasim

Yeah, i know its sarcasm. Just so funny because the Maldives hardly has any navy to speak of. Anyway, does India currently build its own DDGs, FFGs, SSKs, SSNs, and SSBNs indigenously? What are the DDGs currently in the Indian Navy's service? Are IN's Carrier Task Group formidable or not?

And why doesn't the Israeli Navy have any DDGs, SSNs, SSBNs and FFGs? Their army and air force is good, but their navy is crap. Why is that so? Are S. Korean Navy's Aegis KDX-III better than the PLAN's Type 052C Lanzhous?

1.) Yes India builds its own DDG's and FFG's. They also purchase some in Russia.
The most famous of Indian built DDG's are the New Delhi Class. Submarines are purchased from Russia (kilo class). But plans are there to build them indegenously.

2.) DDG's in the Indian fleet are
3 New Delhi Class: http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Delhi.html
5 Rajput Class: http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Rajput.html (1 is the test bed for the Brahmos)
3 Bangalore Class building in Russia : http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Bangalore.html

3.) Indian Carrier task force centered on the Viraat is very formidable, as long as you are not facing the US navy.

Airgroup consists of:

Fleet Defense; Sea Harrier Frs Mk.51 (Capacity for 30)
Airborne Early Warning; Ka-31 Helix-B (By 2001)
Cdo. Assault & Vertrep*; Sea King Mk.42C
ASW/ASV; Sea King Mk.42B and Ka-28 Helix-A

Escorts would be but not limited to:
2 Delhi Class DDGs
2-3 Rajput Class DDGs
1-2 Talwar Class FFG http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Talwar.html
1 Jyoti Class Replinishment ship http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Jyoti.html


4.) Israeli Navy is a low priority for Israel. A naval threat is not very credible.

5.) KDX III
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/rok/kdx-3.htm
http://www.deagel.com/pandora/?p=pm00212001
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/2005/0...oyers/index.php

What do you think?

why is india up there with CHINA DNA JAPAN.. what ahppened to taiwan. didnt they ahve a navy..im sure there navy is better then that of indias or pakistans.

this clearly shows us pakistanis think on our feet (most of us) and not out of extreme nationalism.

S. Korea will have an amazing fleet by 2020, their upcoming projects are looking good, and they have a decent naval air arm, which in the future could probably take on a major power. South Korea is on full alert, so they are trained very well!

the increase in japanese military spending might happen, but by how much, 20-30 billion more each year

japan will have to go through a transformation from a "self defense force" to one that can attack if it wants to rule its part of the sea, as proven by the chinese submarine incident

it is possible that over the next 15 years, and if the japanese government really feels it as a need it will transform its military, but not in 5 years

---

but what does it really mean, because the title of best would mean to complete its objective, and at present that is to defend its terrirtorial waters

a counter argument would revolve around taking over when the americans reduce (not leave) their force strength on japanese islands

so basically it will be retaining the same force but under one flag, and spending alot more

the main reason america would want japan to move up, is to free up american money and men

also japan will have to deal with the exponentially growing number of advanced chinese ships and submarines being produced now, that any build up would hvae to address in the future (china is making 70 ships annually as compared to america's 11 a year; source:new york times, i don't have a link but you can look back through their archives)

so in the end japan doesn't gain much

Who voted for Pakistan...?? Come on man get a life..

I voted for Japan because of many reasons...

for the reason's i mentioned above, i think china will take a lead

it depends hevily on if their economy keeps going the way it is now, and if the EU arms ban is lifted

E.U embargo is the major problem for China in the flield of defence because high tech is western, and I believe Israel is not helping China anymore because it has been kicked out of JSF program. Can anybody confirm this?

China's economy will rather increase than staying the same.

I hear Koizumi is going through some Economic reforms to boost Japan's economy, so Japan still might have the edge over China in the future. But South Korea will have the best navyby 2020. After North Korea is invaded and they're reunified, they'll have to take on the Chinese possibily, who's asses they'll kick by then! Then they'll go to war with Japan and kick their asses! The South Korea will become a world power!

south korea is already a world power, but economically
south korea is tied down to deal with an attack from north korea at any time

your military is geared to dealing with north korea submarines and supporting south korean army and air force

the other threat to south korea are china on one side and japan on the other, over our diputed islands and off shore resources

south korea will probably have great and probably one of the most advanced frigates and destroyers, but the numbers will not be larger than its requirement

south korea is proatically and knows china or japan won't attack it, but disputes over the islands might require muslce flexing so it is only getting enough to maintian a defense force

sort of like pakistan in the face of india's buildup

but china will have many many new ships and if a war had to be fought south korea will probably rely on its air force more, to defend its part of the penisula

and america will stop a dispute between its allies japan and south korea

Well , My dears friends......

You are forgetting one thing................Well no one in world apart from India and Russia have Supersonic Anti-Ship cruise Missile (PJ-10)with Range of 300 Km.....which can be launched from ships, air and land.

These are unstopable anti ship missiles....and can penetrate any defence of ship, even US ships are not immune frome this..

if 100 of these missiles can fire, it can destroy any country's Navy fleet in 5 min. ........

So non of the Navy can stand againt it.

and china with a its huge military budget, dont you think they would have already reverse engineered the Sunburn/moskit missile and have their own Supersonic Anti-Ship cruise Missile project

I still think South Korea will have the most capable navy in 2020. Their naval aviation will far surpass that of Japan and China by then, the F-15K is more capable then the Su-30 and F-2 (But by 2020, we'll be seeing different planes, but then again, South Korea might have a new fighter by then too!), and they will have a nice fleet of ships by 2020, they'll have a lot of stealth ships in by then!

The strongest navies in 2020 wil be the same as today.........

1. Japan.......... Huge military budget with massive hitech American equipment including JSF stealth fighters Awacs & Ageis class destroyers.

2. Another equal size economy but no USA hitech weapons wil put it into second place they will probably have twice as many subs & surface ships as Japan....but not quiet in the hitech league.

3. India....... Third largest GDP with major investment in Carriers su30 mki figters cruise missles and stealth warships....

4. The richest country in Asia in per capita income hitech American weapons will give South Korea a formidable Navy.

5 Taiwan........ Smaller but very hitech and USA equipped..... incl Ageis destroyers..........

TO BE HONEST EXACTLY HAS IT IS TODAY.......

What garbage.

I wish i could predict the future like you can. All of the above points are crazy considering: -

economies change, allies change, technology changes, foriegn policy of countries change, new alliances can be formed, GDP's change, defence contractors change, and many more factors can potentially ensure that in 2020, countries that are not seen as major naval powers can be powers then.

It took Adof Hitler 3 years to produce a HUGE brutal army, when initially, it had sanctions placed on it left right and centre. its economy was non existant prior to Hitler comming to power and yet it had U boats within 2 years of his leadership which it used to devastating effect during the course of WW2.

I know WW2 is a history and a fair while back, but my point is, anything can happen within 3 years let alone 15 years.

For your information

Germany was the strongest economy in WW2 in Europe and third strongest in the world......

Industrial might always HAS and always WILL BE THE SINGLE BIGGEST deciding factor on who developes wat or acquires which where and whom from.......

USA is a super power not by chance.........

UK FRANCE JAPAN GERMANY are rich developed nations with huge GDPs... They are naturally military strong.......

The same is in Asia......

The four largest military budgets in Asia 2005-2006......

Japan $44 billion

China $26 billion officially ( but assumed by cia to be bearer $50 billion))

India $19 billion

South Korea $18 bilion.

NOW GUESS WAT,,,,,,,,,,,, These countries are also the 4 largest econmies of Asia........

GET MY DRIFT.......

its economy was non existant prior to Hitler comming to power

READ what i wrote, having problems reading English? the word PRIOR, means BEFORE. my point was, in a SHORT space of time he, ADOLF HITLER transformed his military, with or without the economy (thats a different issue).

Industrial might always HAS and always WILL BE THE SINGLE BIGGEST deciding factor on who developes wat or acquires which where and whom from.......

WRONG. China has a huge and growing economy, and yet, it cant buy from USA and only recently a European ban was lifted for arms sales to China. Hence, my reasoning that alliances change.

The same is in Asia......

The four largest military budgets in Asia 2005-2006......

Japan $44 billion

China $26 billion officially ( but assumed by cia to be bearer $50 billion))

India $19 billion

South Korea $18 bilion.

SO? whats your point? dollars dont win wars, arms do. yes a strong economy helps but it is NOT the ONLY factor in a war.


NOW GUESS WAT,,,,,,,,,,,, These countries are also the 4 largest econmies of Asia........

WOW, your so clever


GET MY DRIFT.......

No i dont, like usual you chat rubbish.

Well my dear friend Sunburn is sub sonic missile and easy be stop by Barak defence system .....sorry ....

You funny Indian! It goes up to Mach 2!

By 2020 Israel will have 2 advanced 13000-tonnes Amphybious Assault Ships plus 5 nuclear-capable dolphine subs.I dont expect Israeli navy to be the greatest navy of Asia,but now it's the third navy to deploy nuke-capable subs after USA and Russkies.

4th after US, Russia, and CHINA.

That was a rumored program. I didn't hear anything solid about it after. Dolphins are capable of launching nuclear-tipped cruise missiles yes, but it's not in the class of SSBNs by a loooonnnnggg shot. Current SSBN operators are US, Russia, UK, France, and China. With Dolphin and the navalized Popeye, there is limited nuclear strike capability at best. Israelis have a decently well-trained navy, but their mission isn't to overpower anyone in the region, merely to provide defense of their coast and to support naval commando operations on neihboring nations. They have no real heavy industry capability to build and support a massive fleet of large ships, nor do they need one. Their primary concerns are to keep aerial superiority and to maintain mobile offensive capability.

As for the KDX-III, it's hard to compare a ship under construction with another that's practically an unknown factor. However, as far as released data are concerns, KDX-III is larger, more heavily armed, and comes with latest in sensor and combat systems. KDX-III will be armed with up to 80 VLS cells for SAMs (SM-2/3/4?/5? and ESSM) and 48 cells alotted for a mixed load of anti-sub missiles and cruise missiles, as well as the 16 SSM-700K anti-ship missiles. Type52C appeared to be armed with 64 VLSs for the navalized S-300 SAMs. Type52C is more in the class of KDX-2 in terms of Korean warships with firepower.

Strongest in what regard?

If you mean strongest in ability to keep the enemy of its waters and deliver a terrific blow to the enemy, given how small Pakistan's coastline is, yet how big the navy's ambitions are, I'd rate Pakistan.

If it came to overall ability of offensive and defensive, I'd say the U.S, China may have some good ships, but the U.S will have more of the same quality for a long time to come.

If you mean with the strongest mouth, India.

Its between India and China, since they both have huge coastlines and they are expected to be the 2nd and third most powerful countries in the world, respectively, by that time. Right now, India is way ahead of China in naval size and technology. India has a larger navyt right now and it has better ships and weapons. India also has the ability to manufacture aircraft carriers and other combat ships. China has been reverse manufacturing ships and it is not really focussing on navy. Pakistan is not in the picture because it has a small coastline and it will be better off if it spends the moeny that it qwould tkae to build up a navy on infrastructure instead. Also, if things go well, India, China and Pakistan can be allies by that time, so they won't have to worry about each other.

It's Japan with their expected 48 destroyer/frigates, and 17 diesel attack submarines. Once their mobile fleet is complete, they will move to acquire serious aircraft carriers.

They're not allowed to build aircraft carriers! South Korea is, and they'll build one after refurbishing the economy in the North after the Korean War II. They'll put on the F-35 JSF in the future!

Please, have you looked at their 16-DDG plans? They're going to use that as a blue-print as a fast-attack carrier in the future. They will possess a proper CV in the size of the CVF in the least by 2020 or so. All the signs are beginning to point that way. The Escort Flotillas will possess 2 AEGIS air-defense warships plus scores of other 'mini-AEGIS' equipped with FCS-3 and probably ESSM. They are structuring one excellent carrier escort force. All they need now is a proper carrier. They'll use the 16 DDGs in stead right now, but they won't stay in that place for long.

You seem very certain there will be a Korean War II. I can't see that in any forseeable future.

Chinese subs ,as well as French and British ones can launch only ballistic missiles.Israel has much more advanced Popeye Turbo cruise missiles.

If North Korean folks go nuclear,probably this will trigger a nuclear arms race in the whole Far East region.Japan and RoK will surely start preparation for obtaining their own nukes and efficient delivery systems,either by building them locally,or purchasing from the world's dual-tech "black market".Chinese support for DPRK will result in China getting encircled with nuke posessing "friendly" neighbours like Japan.

So far China haven't built any carriers yet. But what are the Chinese doing with the Varyag? Is China adding some components on it to induct it in PLAN service?

China should start research and development of a large indigenous nuclear-powered carrier weighing 90,000 tons and design a navalized version of the J-10. By the time China starts building the first indigenous carrier, the PLAN will already have a handful of DDGs and FFGs.

INDIA R GOING FORWORD WITH MORE SPEED THEN CHINA ONLY LAKING BEHIND IN NUCLEAR SUBMARINES WHERE CHINA IN AIRCRAFT CARRIERS

India leased a lot of nuclear subs from Russia and i heard they actually purchased some. There aren't too many reports about the purcahse though. (probably because both governments covered it up so that htey do not create any international issues.

They also bought some cows from Russia, cause they are quickly dying because lack of water and too much use of urine!

Stop it Cheenamalai ,,,,,,,,,,i don't think you want to bring DOG and Pi*** from China .....Got it ....

If you resplact someone else then also you will get respect......If you throw stone then u also get stone

Actually, I am sure he wouldn't want a DOG and ###### from RUSSIA and BHINDIA

Yaar cheenamalai dont say that unless they say something bad lol.