What are your opinions?
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=7000
Reforming Our Universities
by Pervez Hoodbhoy
There is a severe and long-standing crisis in higher education. But, until the present military government took the initiative, there was no rehabilitation plan. Dr. Atta-ur-Rahman, appointed as chairman of the Higher Education Commission, was the wonder-man charged by General Musharraf with turning the situation around. He was quick to make a powerful pitch for vast increases in funding.
Foreign donors, worried about the implications of Pakistan's sinking educational system, obliged. The higher education budget zoomed by twelve times (1,200 per cent) over three years, a world record. A number of new and innovative utilization schemes were announced.
Some solid achievements did emerge. Internet connectivity in universities has been substantially expanded; distance education is being seriously pursued through the newly established Virtual University; a digital library is in operation; some foreign faculty has been hired; students are being sent abroad for PhD training (albeit largely to second rate institutions); some links with foreign institutions now exist; and money for scientific equipment is no longer a problem. No previous Pakistani government can boast of comparable accomplishments, and the HEC chairman deserves congratulations.
But the HEC is also creating very dangerous, possibly lethal, systemic changes. In this article I will look at the problems in our higher education system and why the HEC reforms are set to make a bad situation worse rather than better. In a subsequent article, I will suggest some modest steps that may offer a way forward.
Pakistan has almost a hundred universities now. Not one of them is world class. Truth be told, not even one of them is a real university, if by a university one means a community of scholars engaged in free inquiry and the creation of knowledge.
Take for example the Quaid-i-Azam University in Islamabad, reputed to be Pakistan's best. Academic activities common in good universities around the world are noticeably absent.
Seminars and colloquia, where faculty present for peer review the results of their on-going research, are few and far between. Public lectures, debates, or discussions of contemporary scientific, cultural, or political issues are almost non-existent.
The teaching at QAU is no better. Rote learning is common, students are not encouraged to ask questions in class, and courses are rarely completed by the end of the semester. This university has three mosques but no bookstore. It is becoming more like a madressah in other ways too.
It was not always this way. The global intellectual ferment of the late 1960's and 70's had a stimulating impact on Pakistani campuses. Intellectual, scientific, cultural and literary activity flourished.
Young Pakistani scholars gave up potential careers in the West to come to Pakistani universities. But in November of 1981, just days after three QAU teachers had been caught with anti-martial law and pro-democracy pamphlets, General Ziaul Haq thundered on television that he would "purge the country's universities of the cancer of politics". He succeeded.
A quarter century later, the faculty are more concerned with money and promotions than research, teaching, or bringing their knowledge to bear on the myriad issues facing our society. Among the students there are many burqas and beards, but minuscule intellectual or creative activity.
All student unions are gone, and ideological disputes have evaporated into the thin air. Instead of left vs right politics there is simple tribalism. Now Punjabi students gang together against Pakhtoon students, Muhajirs versus Sindhis, Shias versus Sunnis, etc.
Some campuses are run by gangs of hoodlums and harbour known criminals, while others have Rangers with machine guns on continuous patrol. On occasion, student wolf packs attack each other with sticks, stones, pistols, and automatic weapons. There are many campus murders.
Most students have not learned how to think; they cannot speak or write any language well, rarely read newspapers, and cannot formulate a coherent argument or manage any significant creative expression.
Dumbed down, this generation of Pakistanis is intellectually handicapped. Like overgrown children, students of my university now kill time by making colourful birthday posters for friends, do "istikhara" (fortune telling), and wander aimlessly in Islamabad's bazaars.
Understanding the scale of the failure is important. Compare Pakistan's premier university with those in its neighbours' capitals. First to the east: Jawaharlal Nehru University, and the Indian Institute of Technology, in Delhi.
Their facilities are simple and functional, nothing like the air-conditioned and carpeted offices of most professors at QAU. And, more important, every notice board is crammed with notices for seminars and colloquia, visitors from the very best foreign universities lecture there, research laboratories hum with activity, and pride and satisfaction are written all around. Conflict on campuses does exist - communist and socialist students battle with Hindutva students over the Gujrat carnage, Iraq, Kashmir, and the BJP doctoring of history.
Angry words are exchanged and polemics are issued against the other, but no heads are bashed. While lecturing at these institutions during a recent visit, I was impressed by the fearlessness and the informed, critical intelligence of the students who questioned and challenged me. I cannot imagine an Indian professor having a similar reception in Pakistan.
Now to the west: Teheran's Sharif University of Technology, and the Institute for Theoretical Physics and Mathematics, are impressive institutions filled with professional activity, workshops, and seminars.
Even as they maintain good academic standards, Iranian university students are heavily political and today are spearheading the movement for freedom and democracy. Iranian students make it to the best US graduate schools.
Although it is an Islamic republic, bookshops are more common than mosques in Tehran. Translations into Farsi appear in just weeks or months after a book is published in the western world.
Driven by the unfavourable comparison with neighbours, the need for university reform finally became an issue. The first big idea was that Pakistan needed more universities.
So today all it takes is a piece of paper from the HEC and some paint. Some colleges have literally had their signboards taken down for repainting, and been put back up changed into "universities" the next day.
By such sleight of hand the current tally of public universities, according to the HEC website, is now officially 47, up from the 23 officially listed in 1996. In addition, there are eight degree awarding public sector institutes.
Unfortunately, this is merely a numbers game. All new public sector universities lack infrastructure, libraries, laboratories, adequate faculty, or even a pool of students academically prepared to study at the university level.
The HEC's "generosity" extends even into largely illiterate tribal areas. There are so-called universities now in Malakand, Bannu, Kohat, Khuzdar, Gujrat, Haripur, and in many other places where it is difficult to detect the slightest potential for successfully establishing modern universities.
Another poorly thought-out, and dangerous, HEC scheme involves giving massive cash awards to university teachers for publishing research papers - Rs 60,000 per paper published in a foreign journal.
Although these stimulants are said to have increased the number of papers published in international journals by a whopping 44 per cent, there is little evidence that this increase in volume is the result of an increase in genuine research activity.
The fact is only a slim minority of Pakistani academics possesses the ethics, motivation, and capability needed for genuine scientific discovery and research. For the majority, the HEC incentives are a powerful reason to discover the art of publishing in research journals without doing research, to find loopholes, and to learn how to cover up one's tracks.
Established practices of plagiarizing papers, multiple publications of slightly different versions of the same paper in different research journals, fabricating scientific data, and seeking out third-rate foreign journals with only token referees are now even more common. The HEC has broadcast the message: corruption pays!
The casual disregard for quality is most obvious in the HEC's massive PhD production programme. This involves enrolling 1,000 students in Pakistani universities every year for PhD degrees.
Thereby Pakistan's "PhD deficit" (it produces less than 50 PhDs per annum at present) will supposedly be solved and it will soon be at par with India. In consequence, an army of largely incapable and ignorant students, armed with hefty HEC fellowships, has sallied forth to write PhD theses.
Although the HEC claims that it has checked the students through a "GRE type test" (the American graduate school admission test), a glance at the question papers reveals it to be only a shoddy literacy and numeric test.
In my department, advertised as the best physics department in the country, the average PhD student now has trouble with high-school level physics and even with reading English.
Nevertheless there are as many as 18 PhD students registered with one supervisor! In the QAU biology department, that number rises to 37 for one supervisor. HEC incentives have helped dilute PhD qualifying exams to the point where it is difficult for any student not to pass. The implications of this mass-production of PhDs are dire. Very soon hundreds and, in time, thousands of worthless PhDs will be cranked out. They will train even less competent students.
Eventually they will become heads of departments and institutions. When appointed gatekeepers, they will regard more competent individuals as threats to be kept locked out. The degenerative spiral, long evident in any number of Pakistani institutions, will worsen rapidly, and become infinitely more difficult to break.
For three decades Pakistani education planners toyed with grand plans to build MITs and Harvards in the country. Nothing materialized. But three years ago the first serious effort to deal with Pakistan's chronically ill universities was finally initiated. Unfortunately, this effort by the Higher Education Commission has now become mired in an intense, growing controversy.
The immediate cause centres on the award of fake degrees and the flourishing of substandard higher education institutions, as well as on the HEC's head, Dr. Atta-ur-Rahman, having personally punished the whistle-blower who brought this important issue to his (and the public's) notice. While unpleasant, this controversy is important because it addresses the deeper underlying question of the quality and credibility - rather than just the quantity - of higher education.
In the previous article, I explained how badly the existing university system has been broken and how the current university reform strategy is compounding the problem by concentrating on glitzy things like internet access, digital libraries, virtual learning, etc., while ignoring basic problems.
Allowing these "reforms" to continue will destroy what little there is today. On the other hand, it will be a tragedy for Pakistan if the current HEC attempts collapse in a heap of dust. So, how to proceed if we are serious in trying to improve our universities?
The policy don'ts are clear. Some have already been discussed earlier: stop the creation of worthless new universities; stop funding and rewarding research that really isn't research; stop dishing out useless PhDs; stop playing the numbers game; and stop feeding academic corruption.
The do's are far more than can be discussed here. Broadly speaking, they can be divided into two mutually distinct sets. One set must deal with raising the level of general competence of teachers and students by ensuring that they actually have an understanding of the subject they teach or study, and with increasing the amount of research in specific disciplines. Universities everywhere prepare engineers, doctors, economists, business managers, and other professionals needed to fulfil the stringent demands of a modern society. Pakistani universities obviously need to do the same.
The second set relates to the broader function of universities - to create thinking minds, pursue research in subjects that are important but are not of immediate economic utility, to create and organize discourses on social and political issues, and to raise the cultural and aesthetic level of society. Whereas the Soviet and Chinese models concentrated exclusively on the first set of goals, western universities - or at least the good ones among them - successfully synthesized both sets and were far superior.
It is a mistake to believe that inadequate financial resources have prevented Pakistani universities from achieving the goals of the first set. In fact, the real need is for deep administrative and organizational reforms, together with the strong political will needed to handle the counter-reaction they would inevitably provoke.
First, there must be university entrance examinations at the national level to separate individuals who can benefit from higher education from those who cannot. No such system exists in Pakistan. Only local board examinations - where rote memorization and massive cheating are rampant - are used to select students.
But, on our borders, both Iran and India have centralized university admissions systems that work very well. Although corruption in India is perhaps as pervasive as in Pakistan, admissions to the IITs have nevertheless retained their integrity and intensely competitive nature over several decades. Honest examinations are presumably also possible in Pakistan, provided extreme care is taken.
Having such university entrance examinations would be important for another reason as well - they would set the goal posts for colleges and high schools all over Pakistan. In the US, the Scholastic Aptitude Tests, centrally administered by Princeton, are extremely useful for deciding student aptitude for university education. The "A" level examinations in Britain have similar importance.
At the PhD level, if the HEC is at all serious about standards, it should make it mandatory for every Pakistani university to require that a PhD candidate achieve a certain minimum in an international examination such as the GRE. These exams are used by US universities for admission into PhD programmes.
Given the state of student and teacher knowledge, and the quantity and quality of research in Pakistani universities, selection through GRE subject tests would have the welcome consequence of cutting down the number enrolled in HEC indigenous PhD programmes from 1,000 per year to a few dozen. The present safeguard of having "foreign experts" evaluate theses is insufficient for a variety of reasons, including the manipulations commonly made in the process of referee selection.
Second, we need to test those who would be university teachers. The system has remained broken for so long that written entrance tests for junior faculty, standardized at a central facility, are essential. Without them, universities will continue to hire teachers who freely convey their confusion and ignorance to students. Most teachers today never consult a textbook, choosing to dictate from notes they saved from the time when they were students in the same department. No teacher has ever been fired for demonstrating incompetence in his/her subject.
Third, the recruitment of non-permanent foreign faculty, whether of Pakistani origin or otherwise, is essential. Although this country is home to 150 million people, there are perhaps fewer than 20 computer scientists of sufficient calibre who could possibly get tenure-track positions at some B-grade US university. In physics, even if one roped in every competent physicist in the country, it would not be possible to staff even one single good department of physics. As for mathematics: it is impossible to find even five real mathematicians in Pakistan. The social sciences are no better.
In this grim situation, it is fortunate that the Higher Education Commission has initiated a programme for hiring foreign faculty with attractive salaries. But the success of this programme is uncertain. Jealousy at salary differentials, and a fear that local incompetence will be exposed, have led local teachers and university administrations to block the hiring of faculty from abroad.
There is another problem: Pakistan's image as a violent country deters most foreigners from wanting to come and live in Pakistan for any considerable period of time. Therefore, westerners are almost totally absent from the list of those who have applied under the foreign faculty hiring programme. Apart from Pakistani expatriates in the Middle East, the bulk of applicants are Russian speakers from the former Soviet Union countries.
One wishes it could be otherwise. It would be a major breakthrough if Indian and Iranian teachers could be brought to Pakistan. Indians, in particular, would find it much easier to adapt to local ways and customs than others and also have smaller salary expectations. The huge pool of strong Indian candidates could be used to Pakistan's advantage - it could pick the best teachers and researchers, and those most likely to make a positive impact on the system. In the present mood of rapprochement, it is hard to think of a more meaningful confidence building measure.
Fourth, we need better, more transparent, and accountable ways to recruit vice-chancellors and senior administrators. What we have now is a patronage system that appoints unqualified and unsuitable bureaucrats or generals as vice-chancellors, and that staffs universities with corrupt and incompetent administrators.
While a tenure-track system for faculty is currently under discussion and may allow for breaking with the system of life-long jobs independent of performance, there is no corresponding system being contemplated for the top leadership. But without good leadership, and people who can set an example, no institution can be reformed.
Finally, it is crucial to bring back on to the campuses meaningful discussions on social, cultural and political issues. To create the culture of civilized debate, student unions must be restored, with elections for student representatives. They will be the next generation of political leaders.
Such a step will not be free from problems - religious vigilantes rule many Pakistani campuses although all unions are banned. Extremists would surely try to take advantage of the new opportunities offered once the ban is lifted. Political parties have also been less than responsible.
But the reinstatement of unions - subject to their elected leaders making a pledge to abjure violence and the disruption of academic activity - is the only way forward towards creating a university culture on campus. Ultimately, reasonable voices, too, will become heard.
To condemn Pakistani students as fundamentally incapable of responsible behaviour amounts to a condemnation of the Pakistani nation itself. If students in our neighbouring countries can successfully study, as well as unionize and engage in larger issues, then surely Pakistan's can do so as well.
The task of university reform has not yet seriously begun. Nor can it do so until issues of the purpose and philosophy of higher education and of the goal of the reforms are squarely confronted. It is time to decide whether we are serious about education being something more than merely giving out certificates. Do we want to build institutions for creating knowledge and helping students to be informed, critical, active citizens? Or not. The author is professor of physics at Quaid-i-Azam University, Islamabad, Pakistan
Full Version: Reforming Pakistan's Universities
definately makes for sober reading. i never went to uni in pakistan but maybe someone who did can shed more light on this. i think Prof. hoodbhoy is quite well regarded so i'm willing to take his views in a positive light....
i do know for a fact that rote learning has been the pakistani education system's downfall. i went to an army public school and went thru the Olevel stream whereas a few friends did the metric stream and said it was all about learning the book by heart and they weren't in the least bit bothered that they couldn't understand anything of what was going on! that can't be a good sign for any country...
regards.
i do know for a fact that rote learning has been the pakistani education system's downfall. i went to an army public school and went thru the Olevel stream whereas a few friends did the metric stream and said it was all about learning the book by heart and they weren't in the least bit bothered that they couldn't understand anything of what was going on! that can't be a good sign for any country...
regards.
Once again Dr. Hoodbhoy comes up with an article high on negativity but very little in terms of meaningful suggestions to improve the situation. Nevertheless, in my view, it is a very important subject and Dr sahib has some valid points in his criticism of the current setup.
The article is very long so i will comment on few points at a time:
can't argue with this, generaly thats the situation in most pakistani university. We don't have a single all-round university having good undergrad, graduate and research programs in a good pool of subjects.
What can we do about it? well nothing much in the short term, It usualy take decades for a good all-round university to develop even if you have "unlimited" resources. What we can do is to have specialized institutes in the fields which are economicaly important to us like engineering, computer science, life sciences, businesss, commerce etc. and over the time branch out to Arts/ humanities and social sciences.
I think the government is doing exactly that by setting up engineering universities with the help of developed countries (fast tracking the usual development process). The existing big public sector universities could focus on arts, literature and humanities in both undergrad and graduate level.
I think it is extremely irresponsible for the author to make such statements, if it was said by a gora, no doubt it would be considered as racist. If someone is able to publish their research papers in internation journals then defenetly it should be considered a big achivement. These journals are reviewed extensively and if there is any plaigarism then sooner or later they will be caught. What this insentive has done is that it has created that research culture which was missing from our academia for a long time. Criticism is easy but in my view this insentive is well intended. You have cheats everywhere and no doubt you will find some in this program as well but it doesnt automaticaly mean this program is a failure.
***more responses later***
The article is very long so i will comment on few points at a time:
QUOTE
Pakistan has almost a hundred universities now. Not one of them is world class. Truth be told, not even one of them is a real university, if by a university one means a community of scholars engaged in free inquiry and the creation of knowledge.
Take for example the Quaid-i-Azam University in Islamabad, reputed to be Pakistan's best. Academic activities common in good universities around the world are noticeably absent.
Seminars and colloquia, where faculty present for peer review the results of their on-going research, are few and far between. Public lectures, debates, or discussions of contemporary scientific, cultural, or political issues are almost non-existent.
Take for example the Quaid-i-Azam University in Islamabad, reputed to be Pakistan's best. Academic activities common in good universities around the world are noticeably absent.
Seminars and colloquia, where faculty present for peer review the results of their on-going research, are few and far between. Public lectures, debates, or discussions of contemporary scientific, cultural, or political issues are almost non-existent.
can't argue with this, generaly thats the situation in most pakistani university. We don't have a single all-round university having good undergrad, graduate and research programs in a good pool of subjects.
What can we do about it? well nothing much in the short term, It usualy take decades for a good all-round university to develop even if you have "unlimited" resources. What we can do is to have specialized institutes in the fields which are economicaly important to us like engineering, computer science, life sciences, businesss, commerce etc. and over the time branch out to Arts/ humanities and social sciences.
I think the government is doing exactly that by setting up engineering universities with the help of developed countries (fast tracking the usual development process). The existing big public sector universities could focus on arts, literature and humanities in both undergrad and graduate level.
QUOTE
Another poorly thought-out, and dangerous, HEC scheme involves giving massive cash awards to university teachers for publishing research papers - Rs 60,000 per paper published in a foreign journal.
Although these stimulants are said to have increased the number of papers published in international journals by a whopping 44 per cent, there is little evidence that this increase in volume is the result of an increase in genuine research activity.
The fact is only a slim minority of Pakistani academics possesses the ethics, motivation, and capability needed for genuine scientific discovery and research. For the majority, the HEC incentives are a powerful reason to discover the art of publishing in research journals without doing research, to find loopholes, and to learn how to cover up one's tracks.
Established practices of plagiarizing papers, multiple publications of slightly different versions of the same paper in different research journals, fabricating scientific data, and seeking out third-rate foreign journals with only token referees are now even more common. The HEC has broadcast the message: corruption pays!
Although these stimulants are said to have increased the number of papers published in international journals by a whopping 44 per cent, there is little evidence that this increase in volume is the result of an increase in genuine research activity.
The fact is only a slim minority of Pakistani academics possesses the ethics, motivation, and capability needed for genuine scientific discovery and research. For the majority, the HEC incentives are a powerful reason to discover the art of publishing in research journals without doing research, to find loopholes, and to learn how to cover up one's tracks.
Established practices of plagiarizing papers, multiple publications of slightly different versions of the same paper in different research journals, fabricating scientific data, and seeking out third-rate foreign journals with only token referees are now even more common. The HEC has broadcast the message: corruption pays!
I think it is extremely irresponsible for the author to make such statements, if it was said by a gora, no doubt it would be considered as racist. If someone is able to publish their research papers in internation journals then defenetly it should be considered a big achivement. These journals are reviewed extensively and if there is any plaigarism then sooner or later they will be caught. What this insentive has done is that it has created that research culture which was missing from our academia for a long time. Criticism is easy but in my view this insentive is well intended. You have cheats everywhere and no doubt you will find some in this program as well but it doesnt automaticaly mean this program is a failure.
***more responses later***
As far as hard sciences are concerned, our universities are as good as any. Quaid-e-Azam University, where the good professor himself teaches is excellent as is NUST, GIKI, AKU, KE, Peshawar etc.
The problem has always been in the humanities. Of that IMO only Punjab Uni come to the mark.
The problem has always been in the humanities. Of that IMO only Punjab Uni come to the mark.
QUOTE(Krad @ Jan 29 2007, 06:20 AM) [snapback]855414[/snapback]
What are your opinions?
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=7000
Reforming Our Universities
by Pervez Hoodbhoy
.
It was not always this way. The global intellectual ferment of the late 1960's and 70's had a stimulating impact on Pakistani campuses. Intellectual, scientific, cultural and literary activity flourished.
Young Pakistani scholars gave up potential careers in the West to come to Pakistani universities. But in November of 1981, just days after three QAU teachers had been caught with anti-martial law and pro-democracy pamphlets, General Ziaul Haq thundered on television that he would "purge the country's universities of the cancer of politics". He succeeded.
How sad pakistan began to lose out in zia decade . one of worst blunders in pakistans history .
but i think greater funding along with rigrous entrance exams can help these universities to raise standards .
As regards indias education system every thing is not rosy i dont find it much good but they do market there universities well .
One problem i found with author is he fine grass on other side is greener its only he grass greener on both east and west .by saying this i dont mean to say that pakistans higher education does not need reform but disparaging your education instutes to such level is not acceptable .
If situation is so bad then where does pakistan get its professionals .
I think Professor H. has good intentions but is a bit of a cynic. He never has anything nice to say about anything unless it is outside Pakistan. Anyway, the article does raise valid concerns about standards in Pakistani institutions and I myself agree with much of what he says. However, these things take time to develop. I think he should have more faith in Professor Rehman who is an acomplished scientist in his own right and an academic. I am sure he knows what he is doing.
I think the crux of what he is moaning about is standards. Well that can only be tackled over time and from what I have seen standards have certainly improved over the last 5 years in Pakistan. Just visit the websites of any of the major universities in Pakistan and look at their faculty lists. You will find more PHd's teaching their subjects now than ever before and many of them trained and lectured abroad.
Professor H. needs to understand that change takes time sepcially when over the last 60 years education has been more or less a neglected sector of social development. You cannot right the wrongs of 3 generations in 10 years. It takes time.
Also, he should not bemoan the number of Phd's under training, i once remember reading an article by him long ago where he was moaning about the numbers of Phd's we produce. Now he is moaning about their quality! Sure, quality if important but then so is the culture of actually going for research and doing doctrates. Dr Rehman is putting in place the framework within which research and Phd's can be produced. I am sure over time and with the right funding the standard will improve as well.
A good Phd graduate doesnt happen at university it starts with a good primary, secondary and under-graduate education. We need to look at our system holistically ie a world class primary education system, and then a world class secondary education system followed by a world class college system will produce world class PHd's.
i could go on and on but i think I will stop here. I have said most of what i wanted to say.
The current educational system in Pakistan is pathetic, how can your universities succeed when the basic system of education is worst of its kind. I study in FAST-NU which if quite reputable in Pkistan and I learned major flaws in University systems which you can multiply with several digits in case of public universitites.
1. Most instructors quite frankly ar incapable and the ones who are harrassed by the incapables because their is no threat to them
2. Our universities have tiny budgets as compare to any university of the world
3. There is no space in which the student can groom
4. Most students are incapable to comprehend what the instructor taches especially the ones from Pakistani educational systems
5. Public universities have problems have problems small number of faculty which never wants to teach but plays plitical cards only
6. Most students never use library if their is any in university by chance. you will find them by-hearting notes given by he pathetic instructor who copied them from a book or internet.
7. Nill R&D
8. Most of the instructors especially the ones with PH.Ds have unsual behaviour that they are king of the world. Why I dont know, I think due to pathetic culture of Pakistan!!!
9. Public universities should be called the war theatre of politics because you will see studnet study less and fight more often and it goes for instructors
1. Most instructors quite frankly ar incapable and the ones who are harrassed by the incapables because their is no threat to them
2. Our universities have tiny budgets as compare to any university of the world
3. There is no space in which the student can groom
4. Most students are incapable to comprehend what the instructor taches especially the ones from Pakistani educational systems
5. Public universities have problems have problems small number of faculty which never wants to teach but plays plitical cards only
6. Most students never use library if their is any in university by chance. you will find them by-hearting notes given by he pathetic instructor who copied them from a book or internet.
7. Nill R&D
8. Most of the instructors especially the ones with PH.Ds have unsual behaviour that they are king of the world. Why I dont know, I think due to pathetic culture of Pakistan!!!
9. Public universities should be called the war theatre of politics because you will see studnet study less and fight more often and it goes for instructors
The author has summarized the problems and the solutions beautifully.
But the worrying factor is that new teachers and students which are in the pipeline are the products of the current system. The problem does not lie at the top level of education, but it lies at the grass root level. Our schooling is extremely inadequate. Those who have done matriculation and intermediate in Pakistan precisely know how easy it is to prepare for the final papers in just a few days. Previous years papers are easily available and the questions are repeated in a certain pattern yearly. As a result students do pass the examinations but they do not learn. For example: A student is taught Urdu and English as compulsory subjects for 12 years, and even after those twelve years the student speaks a language that is neither English nor Urdu, the student writes Urdu sentences using English alphabets and is unable to speak or understand English.
But the worrying factor is that new teachers and students which are in the pipeline are the products of the current system. The problem does not lie at the top level of education, but it lies at the grass root level. Our schooling is extremely inadequate. Those who have done matriculation and intermediate in Pakistan precisely know how easy it is to prepare for the final papers in just a few days. Previous years papers are easily available and the questions are repeated in a certain pattern yearly. As a result students do pass the examinations but they do not learn. For example: A student is taught Urdu and English as compulsory subjects for 12 years, and even after those twelve years the student speaks a language that is neither English nor Urdu, the student writes Urdu sentences using English alphabets and is unable to speak or understand English.
PakiWarrior,
I agree 100% with your comments. I had the unfortunate experince of spending a semester in another "reputable" university in islamabad...I am so glad that I got the chance to move abroad and continue my education there.
The problem I had were with the profs, the student body was generaly very smart(due to the entrance exams and interview) and I can say for sure that they would do well in most universities abroad.
One crazy trend in islamabad was that most of faculty were not permanent. They were teaching at 3-4 universities at the same time and hence there was no concept of after class help, office hours etc.
nightsurfer,
The current matriculation and intermediate system is fundamentaly wrong, no doubt about it. But I don't think this is the main reason for the education slump. People coming out of this system have done well in both local and foriegn universities. I went through this system myself and didn't find university education more challenging than anyone else and I am not an exception or anything. I would say even O/A Level system is flawed because of the emphasis on the final exam only. Good universities in pakistan can generaly weed out the the rataa crowd by having SAT style entrance exams, which most already have but the problem is that each university try to do their own thing which creates tons of problems for the applicants. I had to write 5 different tests after my Fsc, which was a pain in the a**. May be, a private body can take up this examination thing and report the marks to the universities you applied to.
I agree 100% with your comments. I had the unfortunate experince of spending a semester in another "reputable" university in islamabad...I am so glad that I got the chance to move abroad and continue my education there.
The problem I had were with the profs, the student body was generaly very smart(due to the entrance exams and interview) and I can say for sure that they would do well in most universities abroad.
One crazy trend in islamabad was that most of faculty were not permanent. They were teaching at 3-4 universities at the same time and hence there was no concept of after class help, office hours etc.
nightsurfer,
The current matriculation and intermediate system is fundamentaly wrong, no doubt about it. But I don't think this is the main reason for the education slump. People coming out of this system have done well in both local and foriegn universities. I went through this system myself and didn't find university education more challenging than anyone else and I am not an exception or anything. I would say even O/A Level system is flawed because of the emphasis on the final exam only. Good universities in pakistan can generaly weed out the the rataa crowd by having SAT style entrance exams, which most already have but the problem is that each university try to do their own thing which creates tons of problems for the applicants. I had to write 5 different tests after my Fsc, which was a pain in the a**. May be, a private body can take up this examination thing and report the marks to the universities you applied to.
Education system takes "LITERALLY DECADES" of transformation.
look at us, 6% of GDP one ducation, 1% goes to politicians pockets so 5% still LONG way to transform.
There are students with that of calliber more than IIT in slums etc etc but no education
its long and slow process.
pakistan better starts kickin it off, and oh involve pvt industries as much as one can its better.
look at us, 6% of GDP one ducation, 1% goes to politicians pockets so 5% still LONG way to transform.
There are students with that of calliber more than IIT in slums etc etc but no education
its long and slow process.
pakistan better starts kickin it off, and oh involve pvt industries as much as one can its better.
Current Gov will build 9 engineering universities in next 3-4 years with help of developed world which will cost 250 billionRs ($4.2 billion) but what about previous 50 years wasted? In all those years Pakistan could only build 9 engineering universities and that to of bad quality. 
@ilyas
My friend those people are the best of the lot. Sadly, due to inadequate higher education system half of them choose to move abroad and I am one of them.
Absolutely right.
My friend those people are the best of the lot. Sadly, due to inadequate higher education system half of them choose to move abroad and I am one of them.
QUOTE
Good universities in pakistan can generaly weed out the the rataa crowd by having SAT style entrance exams, which most already have but the problem is that each university try to do their own thing which creates tons of problems for the applicants.
Absolutely right.
I have mentioned this over and over again ad nauseum!
without a good foundation at primary and secondary level education we cannot hope to have a world class education system at university level!
India spends 8% or there abouts on its education, we spend something like 3-4%. what do you hope to achieve by that?
the crux of the matter is spending. unless you spend you dont get. That money needs to be used for better teacher training and school facilities.
The examination system needs an overhaul as well.
the problems are many and the rupees are few. that needs to be adjusted on a priority basis.
I met a guy on a train once as i was travelling from Lahore to Rawalpindi. He said he was doing a Masters in English. Wanted to speak English with me. He couldnt understand half of what i was saying and his English was not even half as good as my grandfathers who was only an F.A from back in the 1930's. we ended up speaking in Urdu.
I was saddened by the whole experience.
DEAR ALL
VERY GOOD DISCUSSION ABD I HAVE TO AGREE WITH SOME OF THE PART OF THIS COLUMN, BUT SLOWLY AND SURLY THINGS ARE GETTING BETTER, BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT WE HAVE TO IMPROVE OUR SYSTEM FROM GRASS ROOOT LEVEL. AS Hellraiser006 RIGHTLY MENTIONED THAT WE HAVE TO IMPROVE OUR SYSTEMS IN SCHOOL. WE HAVE TO GET RID OF RATA SYSTEM.
FOR ME TILL MATRIC EDUCATION IS FOR ALL AND NO WRITTEN EXAMS TILL MATRIC (RATA SYSTEM) ONLY PRESENTATIONS, DISCUSSIONS, AND PRACTICALS TO BE TESTED ANNUALLY ACCORDING TO STAGE.
NO MERITT SYSTEM FOR ADMISSION IN FSC. LIKE AFTER GETTING 710 MARKS WAITING FOR COLLEGE MERIT LIST TO BE DISPLAYED AND FOUND OH MERIT WAS 712 AND I DIDNT GET ADMISSION AND GUY WHO TOOK 400 MARKS IS IN COLLEGE COZ OF ANY REASON (IT IS IRRELEVENT) AND IF WE ARE GOING TO SELECT ENGINEERING WE SHOULD BE FREE TO SELECT REST OF THE SUBJECT AGAIN AFTER TWO YEARS OF COMPREHENSIVE STUDY THE EXAMS SHOULD NOT BE LIKE SOLVE 8 QUESTION OUT OF 10 OR 10 OUT OF 10. IT IS BULL ####. AGAIN PRACTICAL, CLASS PARTICIPATION, PRESENTATION, AND COMPREHENSIVE. SO IN UNIVERSITIES IT SHOULD BE LIKE WHAT INTERNATIONALLY ADOPTED THAT ACCORDING TO CAREER PATH WE SHOULD SELECT SUBJECTS. TILL MY GRADUATION SUCH A STUPID THEORIES AND PRACTICAL SUBJECTS WERE THERE WHICH NO WHERE NEAR TO PRACTICALLY IAM DOING.
VISITING FACULTY PROB IS THERE BUT THERE ARE BLESSING IN SHAPE OF THOSE VISITING FACULTIES ARE ALSO THERE, SPECIALLY IN MANAGEMENT AND FINANCE SUBJECTS.
BUT MY OPINION IS EVERY UNIVERSITY IS GIVEN THE STATUS OF UNI WHEN THAT UNI HAS THE FACILITY OF R&D SPECIALLY SCIENCE UNIVERSITIES.
AND ABOUT OUR NEIBOURS THEY HAVE GOOD UNIVERSITIES BUT AS COUNTRY ON MASSES THEY ARE ONLY PRODUCING JUST DEGREE HOLDERS, I AM AN MBA IN FINANCE BUT PASSED GRADUATION OF ACMA(INCOMPLETE ACMA) WHEN I JOIN ORGANISATION IN DUBAI I COME ACROSS OUR ACCOUNTANT WHO TRY TO TEACH ME ACCOUNTING ( HE DONT KNOW I HAVE BACK GROUND OF ACCOUNTS) AND SWEAR I DONT KNOW HE IS C.A COZ HE DONT LOOK LIKE HE TEACHES ME WRONG CONCEPT WHEN I MADE HIM CLEAR ON CERTAIN ACCOUNTING CONCEPT HE WAS SHOCKED AND HE NEVER ASKED ME ANY THING AND KEEP AVOIDING ME IN MEETINGS ALSO. HA SWEET FINANCIAL CONTROLLER. BIJOU AND HIS TEAM. THEY ARE JUST PRODUCING GRADUATE ON MASSES AND IN PAKISTAN ACMA IS HELL DIFFICULT AS CA ALSO BUT QUALITY DIFFERENCE IS THERE. AS MY UNCLE IS CHEMICAL ENGINEER IN KRL AND WHEN I COMPARE THEM TO INDIAN PHD ENGINEER HERE THER IS LOT OF DIFFERENCE IN THERE APPROACH, SO WE HAVE VERY GOOD INSTITUTIONS WE NEED ONLY TO HAVE GOOD MARKETING AS THOSE BHINDIANS ARE DOING THEY ALL ARE VER GOOD AT MARKETING.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL
(FOR GIVE ME FOR CAPS COZ OF MMY INTERNAL SOFTWARE I USE CAPS AND I WRITE THESE POSTS IN INTERWALS SO AGAIN SORRY GUYS
PAKISTAN ZINDABAD
VERY GOOD DISCUSSION ABD I HAVE TO AGREE WITH SOME OF THE PART OF THIS COLUMN, BUT SLOWLY AND SURLY THINGS ARE GETTING BETTER, BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT WE HAVE TO IMPROVE OUR SYSTEM FROM GRASS ROOOT LEVEL. AS Hellraiser006 RIGHTLY MENTIONED THAT WE HAVE TO IMPROVE OUR SYSTEMS IN SCHOOL. WE HAVE TO GET RID OF RATA SYSTEM.
FOR ME TILL MATRIC EDUCATION IS FOR ALL AND NO WRITTEN EXAMS TILL MATRIC (RATA SYSTEM) ONLY PRESENTATIONS, DISCUSSIONS, AND PRACTICALS TO BE TESTED ANNUALLY ACCORDING TO STAGE.
NO MERITT SYSTEM FOR ADMISSION IN FSC. LIKE AFTER GETTING 710 MARKS WAITING FOR COLLEGE MERIT LIST TO BE DISPLAYED AND FOUND OH MERIT WAS 712 AND I DIDNT GET ADMISSION AND GUY WHO TOOK 400 MARKS IS IN COLLEGE COZ OF ANY REASON (IT IS IRRELEVENT) AND IF WE ARE GOING TO SELECT ENGINEERING WE SHOULD BE FREE TO SELECT REST OF THE SUBJECT AGAIN AFTER TWO YEARS OF COMPREHENSIVE STUDY THE EXAMS SHOULD NOT BE LIKE SOLVE 8 QUESTION OUT OF 10 OR 10 OUT OF 10. IT IS BULL ####. AGAIN PRACTICAL, CLASS PARTICIPATION, PRESENTATION, AND COMPREHENSIVE. SO IN UNIVERSITIES IT SHOULD BE LIKE WHAT INTERNATIONALLY ADOPTED THAT ACCORDING TO CAREER PATH WE SHOULD SELECT SUBJECTS. TILL MY GRADUATION SUCH A STUPID THEORIES AND PRACTICAL SUBJECTS WERE THERE WHICH NO WHERE NEAR TO PRACTICALLY IAM DOING.
VISITING FACULTY PROB IS THERE BUT THERE ARE BLESSING IN SHAPE OF THOSE VISITING FACULTIES ARE ALSO THERE, SPECIALLY IN MANAGEMENT AND FINANCE SUBJECTS.
BUT MY OPINION IS EVERY UNIVERSITY IS GIVEN THE STATUS OF UNI WHEN THAT UNI HAS THE FACILITY OF R&D SPECIALLY SCIENCE UNIVERSITIES.
AND ABOUT OUR NEIBOURS THEY HAVE GOOD UNIVERSITIES BUT AS COUNTRY ON MASSES THEY ARE ONLY PRODUCING JUST DEGREE HOLDERS, I AM AN MBA IN FINANCE BUT PASSED GRADUATION OF ACMA(INCOMPLETE ACMA) WHEN I JOIN ORGANISATION IN DUBAI I COME ACROSS OUR ACCOUNTANT WHO TRY TO TEACH ME ACCOUNTING ( HE DONT KNOW I HAVE BACK GROUND OF ACCOUNTS) AND SWEAR I DONT KNOW HE IS C.A
COZ HE DONT LOOK LIKE HE TEACHES ME WRONG CONCEPT WHEN I MADE HIM CLEAR ON CERTAIN ACCOUNTING CONCEPT HE WAS SHOCKED AND HE NEVER ASKED ME ANY THING AND KEEP AVOIDING ME IN MEETINGS ALSO. HA SWEET FINANCIAL CONTROLLER. BIJOU AND HIS TEAM. THEY ARE JUST PRODUCING GRADUATE ON MASSES AND IN PAKISTAN ACMA IS HELL DIFFICULT AS CA ALSO BUT QUALITY DIFFERENCE IS THERE. AS MY UNCLE IS CHEMICAL ENGINEER IN KRL AND WHEN I COMPARE THEM TO INDIAN PHD ENGINEER HERE THER IS LOT OF DIFFERENCE IN THERE APPROACH, SO WE HAVE VERY GOOD INSTITUTIONS WE NEED ONLY TO HAVE GOOD MARKETING AS THOSE BHINDIANS ARE DOING THEY ALL ARE VER GOOD AT MARKETING.GOD BLESS YOU ALL
(FOR GIVE ME FOR CAPS COZ OF MMY INTERNAL SOFTWARE I USE CAPS AND I WRITE THESE POSTS IN INTERWALS SO AGAIN SORRY GUYS
PAKISTAN ZINDABAD
^^ he faked you that hes CA then.
and no we are not producing only degrees there are mixed success.
as hellraiser said my granddad knew more english than me studying 4m english medium...
and no we are not producing only degrees there are mixed success.
as hellraiser said my granddad knew more english than me studying 4m english medium...
Pakistan universities are good enough to produce Technicians and corrupt civil service. There is not a single University in Pakistan we can call a "University" as in Western country. There is no research in any Engineering subjects.
Pakistan basic education from primary, to secondary is at fault which does not prepair students for further education. Money is not spend on Higher education at all. India and Pakistan started on same footing in 1947 but India realize the value of education for nation advancment and we tryied to destroyed what ever we had, we have not a single Institue like IIT Banglore.
I come cross many research articals written by Indians.particularly in electronic field which I understand, being an engineer for last 35 years in Canada.
All the progress in Atomic and Missile technology is carried out by forgien trained professionals.
Pakistan basic education from primary, to secondary is at fault which does not prepair students for further education. Money is not spend on Higher education at all. India and Pakistan started on same footing in 1947 but India realize the value of education for nation advancment and we tryied to destroyed what ever we had, we have not a single Institue like IIT Banglore.
I come cross many research articals written by Indians.particularly in electronic field which I understand, being an engineer for last 35 years in Canada.
All the progress in Atomic and Missile technology is carried out by forgien trained professionals.
QUOTE(ac/dc @ Jan 31 2007, 04:20 AM) [snapback]856629[/snapback]
^^ he faked you that hes CA then.
and no we are not producing only degrees there are mixed success.
as hellraiser said my granddad knew more english than me studying 4m english medium...
NO NO IAM NOT SAYING THAT INDIA IS ONLY PRODUCING MASSES AS NOT QUALITY STUDENT!!!! BUT MIXED SUCCESS BUT I HAVNT C MAJORITY AS QUALITY STUDENTS, SPCIALLY FROM SOUTH INDIA, IDONT KNOW THIS IS MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE AND EVERY ONE HAS RIGHT TO CONTRADICT, IAM NOT SAYIN THAT HE BLUFF TO ME HE WAS FINANCIAL CONTROLLER AND HIS NAME PLATE WAS HANGING OUTSIDE HIS DOOR.
AND YES IF WE COMPARE TODAYS STUDY STANDARD MY FATHER(GOD MAY REST HIS SOUL IN PEACE) WAS ONLY FSC STUDENT BUT HE LOOK MORE QUALIFIED THAN TODAYS MASTERS HIS KNOWLEDGE ON SUBJECT WHICH HE STUDIED IN MATRICWAS ENOUGH THAT HE CAN TEACH TO GRADUATE COZ TEACHERS WERE AT THAT TIME WAS DEVOTED TO THEIR WORK AND GIVE FULL ATTENTION TO EACH STUDENT AND STUDENT AT THAT TIME WAS ALSO WILLING TO LEARN. NOW EVERY ONE IS IN SEACH OF SHORT CUT. AND EXPERIENCE MATTER ALSO ALONG WITH PERSONAL EFFORTS.
Pakistan universities are good enough to produce Technicians and corrupt civil service. There is not a single University in Pakistan we can call a "University" as in Western country. There is no research in any Engineering subjects.
Pakistan basic education from primary, to secondary is at fault which does not prepair students for further education. Money is not spend on Higher education at all. India and Pakistan started on same footing in 1947 but India realize the value of education for nation advancment and we tryied to destroyed what ever we had, we have not a single Institue like IIT Banglore.
I come cross many research articals written by Indians.particularly in electronic field which I understand, being an engineer for last 35 years in Canada.
All the progress in Atomic and Missile technology is carried out by forgien trained professionals.
I DO AGREE THAT PAKISTAN HAS REALISED VERY LATE AND THEY STARTED VERY LATE AS COMPARED TO INDIA BUT I DO NOT AGREE THAT MISSILE AND ATOMIC TECH IS CARRIED BY FORIEGNERS COZ THERE ARE HUNDREDS OF PAKISTANI ENGINEER AND TECNICIAN IN KRL, YA THEY ARE TRAINED AND SEND FOR QUALIFICATION TO OTHERCOUNTRIES LATER.
AS TALKING ABOUT RESEARCH PAPER WHEN I PLANNED FOR ACMA I CAME ACROSS BOOKS OF ACCOUNTING WHICH WAS WRITTEN BY INDIAN AUTHORS WE WERE ASTONISHED THAT EVERY 2ND ACCOUNTING BOOK WAS FROM INDIAN AUTHOR AND WHEN WE GO IN FURTHER CLASSES WHERE I COME ACROSS SOME BOOKS FROM EUORPEAN AUTHERS AND THAN WE COME TO KNOW THAT MANY OF INDIAN AUTHORS JUST DID ONE THING OTHER THAN COPY PASTE IS THAT THEY PUT NAME RAMDIN AND SHUKLA LIKE THAT IN STEAD OF JOHN AND BUT STILL THEY ARE FAR AHEAD IN THIS ASPECT FROM US.
BUT AGAIN WE LACK INFRASTRUCTURE AND R&D TO DO RESEARCH WORK. THEY ARE VERY GOOD AT MARKETING, BUT WHEN THEIR STUDENT COME OUT OF SCHOOL HE HAS PLAN IN HIS MIND. BUT AS IN PAKISTAN WHEN WE CAME OUT OF SCHOOL WE ARE THINKING K IF I GOT THIS MUCH MARKS I WILL JOIN THIS AND IF I GOT THIS MUCH MARKS I WILL JOIN THAT NO CLEAR CAREER PLANNING AGAIN BECAUSE OF SCHOOL EDUCATION AND LEVEL OF EDUCATION AND THINKING LEVEL IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT IN OUR SOCITY.
WE LOOK MORE GOOD OR ORGANISED OR SOCIAL JUST BECAUSE OF ONE FACTOR OTHERWISE WE WOULD HAVE BEEN WAY BACK FROM THEM IN SOCIAL GROUNDS AND THAT IS ONLY BECAUSE OF OUR QURANIC STUDIES AND STUDIES IN WHICH WE R TOLD BY OUR PARENTS K C WE ARE MULIMS WE DO LIKE THIS AND OUR PROFIT TOLD US EAT LIKE THIS BEHAVE LIKE THIS AND ALLL SOCIAL ASPECTS OTHER WIOSE SOCIALLY WE WOULD HAVE BEEN COLAPSED. THANK TO OUR GOD AND HOLY PROPHET( PBUH).
I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU TO DISCUSS PLEAS HOW WE CAN IMPROVE OUR SYSTEM. DISCUSSION MUST BE THOUGHT FUL.
REGARDS
PAKISTAN ZINDABAD
har saal Education system aor... method of examination change kia ja raha ha..students ka future taba kia ja raha ha...
akhir ya reforming kab tak chala ge ? koi limit to hoti ha..lakin yaha to infinit ha
iger app ko maree baat par yaqeen nahe too ja kar khood kisee Govt ka teacher ya professor ko pooch loo
wo galiya nikalta hain govt ko....
ILA MASHALLAH
hamra education minister sahib be kitnaa qabil hain ka un ko too itna be nahe pata ka Quran ka kitna Parra hota hain ...
education minister sahib MSC in war statergy main hain ... lakin ab un ki war statergies schools aor college aor universities ka students par chalti hain... TA ka koi student parr likh kar ... Dr.QAdeer na ban jaya
....
Remember this statement by US Abmssdar... Riyan ....
Pakistan main ab koi Dr. Qadeer nahe aya ga !!!
Pakistan being in a transition phase, like anything else, its a glass half empty or half full scenario. We could argue on good points and bad points. But the important aspect of it is that the HEC has done a phenominal job so far and has brought a change to our failed system. Hundreds of qualified Ph.Ds have been recruited from abroad and university's labs have been improved and their research budgets have quadrupled.
The change may not be so visible but its there and making a difference that we'll feel few years from now. Ofcourse nothing changes overnight. Many of the problems that the article mentions has to do with lack of enough Ph.Ds in our universities who support and sustain an environment of research and development. InshAllah with time more and more Ph.Ds will be produced and our universities and students will have more intellectual resource.
HEC has also formed and is following standards guidelines with the universities where universities are being graded for their standards; quality of education, amount of space, labs, research facilities, teachers' qualification and much more. Of course, its not going to shut down the bad universities but it informs the public about institutions and their quality and will provide an incentive for bad ones to improve.
Universities and their standards will improve and we will have some of the best ones in another decade. But the most important reforms needed, as some of you mentioned, are in the primary level schooling which not only educates a child, but also creates an effective and productive future citizen.
The change may not be so visible but its there and making a difference that we'll feel few years from now. Ofcourse nothing changes overnight. Many of the problems that the article mentions has to do with lack of enough Ph.Ds in our universities who support and sustain an environment of research and development. InshAllah with time more and more Ph.Ds will be produced and our universities and students will have more intellectual resource.
HEC has also formed and is following standards guidelines with the universities where universities are being graded for their standards; quality of education, amount of space, labs, research facilities, teachers' qualification and much more. Of course, its not going to shut down the bad universities but it informs the public about institutions and their quality and will provide an incentive for bad ones to improve.
Universities and their standards will improve and we will have some of the best ones in another decade. But the most important reforms needed, as some of you mentioned, are in the primary level schooling which not only educates a child, but also creates an effective and productive future citizen.
QUOTE(rasahmad @ Jan 31 2007, 07:36 PM) [snapback]856701[/snapback]
Pakistan universities are good enough to produce Technicians and corrupt civil service. There is not a single University in Pakistan we can call a "University" as in Western country. There is no research in any Engineering subjects.
Pakistan basic education from primary, to secondary is at fault which does not prepair students for further education. Money is not spend on Higher education at all. India and Pakistan started on same footing in 1947 but India realize the value of education for nation advancment and we tryied to destroyed what ever we had, we have not a single Institue like IIT Banglore.
I come cross many research articals written by Indians.particularly in electronic field which I understand, being an engineer for last 35 years in Canada.
All the progress in Atomic and Missile technology is carried out by forgien trained professionals.
sadly the same could be said about india . The point where Indian universities score is that these institutions religously guard who gets inside this active filtering prevents degradation of quality and guarentees only best can get in . As regarding research thier record is as dismal as pakistans but where they have excelled is to churn out professionals who later excel in west (either in research or in jobs ).
It will take Time to prodouce world class universities Shore up your resources and produce quality students in the mean time some good universities will come up but make sure dont have bad univrersities.
Also let me add this even in india you can see people doing MA in english but unable to speak english .
So dont lose heart strive for excelence and you will see noticable diffrence soon . Finaly dont Disparage your technichians and civilservants its thier quality which will determine progress.
QUOTE(umiqum @ Feb 1 2007, 02:16 AM) [snapback]856900[/snapback]
Pakistan being in a transition phase, like anything else, its a glass half empty or half full scenario. We could argue on good points and bad points. But the important aspect of it is that the HEC has done a phenominal job so far and has brought a change to our failed system. Hundreds of qualified Ph.Ds have been recruited from abroad and university's labs have been improved and their research budgets have quadrupled.
The change may not be so visible but its there and making a difference that we'll feel few years from now. Ofcourse nothing changes overnight. Many of the problems that the article mentions has to do with lack of enough Ph.Ds in our universities who support and sustain an environment of research and development. InshAllah with time more and more Ph.Ds will be produced and our universities and students will have more intellectual resource.
HEC has also formed and is following standards guidelines with the universities where universities are being graded for their standards; quality of education, amount of space, labs, research facilities, teachers' qualification and much more. Of course, its not going to shut down the bad universities but it informs the public about institutions and their quality and will provide an incentive for bad ones to improve.
Universities and their standards will improve and we will have some of the best ones in another decade. But the most important reforms needed, as some of you mentioned, are in the primary level schooling which not only educates a child, but also creates an effective and productive future citizen.
I wanted to write same things . You are bang on regarding primary education and your post is crisp clear withoui emotions of euphoria or despair .Truly a great post
http://www.dawn.com/2007/02/10/ed.htm#4
HEC’s unconvincing mega projects
By Pervez Hoodbhoy
THE on-going efforts at reforming higher education are turning into a disaster. Billions are being spent on mindless mega projects. The 15-fold increase in the funding of Pakistani universities over the last six years may have delivered a marginal improvement, but it is superficial and likely to be temporary.
These facts are the subject of a researched article, “In Pakistan, the Problems That Money Can Bring”, published in the January 2007 issue of the well-respected New York based Chronicle of Higher Education. The Chronicle notes that in Pakistan the failure of the HEC (Higher Education Commission) to create and adequately implement rules has caused an explosion of substandard universities, fake and substandard degrees, meaningless research publications and a massive wave of unpunished plagiarised academic papers.
More grand folly is in the works. Among the government’s most expensive projects are the nine new engineering universities to be spread across the country. Officially associated with France, Sweden, Italy, Austria, Germany, Japan, as well as other countries, these universities are supposed to meet the acute shortage in Pakistan of international quality engineering education. Contrary to the general impression that these are foreign funded, in fact 100 per cent of the development, recurrent and salary costs will be paid for by Pakistan. This would be okay if the basic ingredients for success were there. They are not.
First, there are far too few qualified Pakistanis who can teach modern engineering subjects at an international professional level. There may be no more than two to three dozen suitable engineering professors in all of Pakistan’s engineering universities. This is a tiny fraction needed by the Rs 26 billion French University (the proposed name is UESTP-France@Karachi) which will eventually require 600 qualified Pakistani Ph.D teachers. The Rs 37 billion Pak-Swedish University, to be located in Sialkot, will need even more. Add more universities (Italy, Austria, Japan…), and you begin to glimpse the scale of the problem!
Looking for so many Pakistani engineering professors living abroad will not help. A national and international search by the upcoming LUMS School of Science and Engineering has – after two years of intensive effort – netted less than a dozen suitable future faculty members, with perhaps another dozen or two in the pipeline. This is despite LUMS’ good reputation and the very high salaries it has offered. Nothing can change the simple fact that Pakistanis in science and engineering subjects, whether at home or abroad, are far too few in numbers.
So, does the answer lie in sending thousands of Pakistanis to the West for a Ph.D in engineering or science and then waiting a few years? This route, while superficially attractive, also has serious difficulties. Foreign training is expensive. Many will not return, some because they did not succeed and others because they succeeded too well.One also fears that many of the ones who do return after completing their Ph.Ds would not have really mastered their respective disciplines. Approximately, a thousand Pakistanis sent recently to European universities have been selected on the basis of a rather trivial locally made numeracy and literacy test. International level tests were not required of students sent to Europe. (But, in a public declaration of its state of confusion and muddle-headedness, the HEC has placed advertisements in national newspapers formally requiring the authentic, but more difficult, international GRE subject test for registration into the Ph.D programmes of Pakistani universities!)
Visiting teams of European professors interviewed Pakistani students but, according to the students I have talked to, these were generally rather perfunctory. For whatever reasons, these teams were apparently softer than normal when selecting Pakistanis. This unfortunately means that Pakistanis returning from European universities will not be as good as others who have studied at the same universities.
So, what about hiring a European teaching faculty? Plans say that the heads of the new engineering universities will be professors from the EU countries, and Europeans will constitute five to 10 per cent of the total faculty strength. Let us set aside for the moment that Pakistan will pay the visiting European professors EU level salaries (with a 40 per cent mark-up to cover other expenses). The question still remains whether these professors will be accomplished teachers or researchers, or whether they are second-raters in their own countries.
Past experience of bringing faculty from abroad has not been good. There is scarcely a white European or American to be found in any Pakistani university. Huge salaries paid under the HEC’s four-year old foreign faculty programme has brought to Pakistan a handful of good dedicated professionals on contract appointments. They are guiding students, teaching and doing research. But the overwhelming majority of the foreign faculty comprises academic mercenaries from Russia, Ukraine, the Central Asian republics, as well as expatriate Pakistanis. They have little interest beyond the pecuniary.
The reliance on European faculty for Pak-European universities is obviously critical. But, according to French sources, as of early February 2007, no French vice-chancellor or faculty member has yet been appointed. (Pak-French will be followed by Pak-Sweden in 2008 and then other universities). Nevertheless, teaching officially starts in 2007. This bespeaks a planning disaster of grand proportions.
Worse may lie ahead. Suicide attacks within Pakistan are now averaging two a week or more. Will this discourage long-term European faculty in residence? How many professionally active foreign scientists and engineers will opt for a life under barricades and armed guards in places like Sialkot, Multan or Khairpur?
These are daunting conditions for developing higher education in Pakistan – for any policymaker. The problems are many, not just that of adequate faculty for the nine engineering universities. For example, the tens of thousands of academically well-equipped, entry-level students, who would constitute the input into the Pak-European universities, will not be available for many years. This would be true even if things start going perfectly well as of today.
Whim dominates planning. The HEC’s urge to constantly trumpet victory is moving higher education away from the path of the patient and careful academic development that it needs. Various products of an unconstrained imagination, such as the nine Pak-European universities, have been approved without a proper feasibility study. Senior government officers, whose duty it is to guard public finances, have surrendered under fear and political pressure.
In any country that abides by the basic principles of governance, this would surely be sufficient reason for a public inquiry. The planning commission and the finance ministry are said to have already released hundreds of millions of rupees for the Pak-European university project on the basis of a skimpy two-page “concept paper”. This bypasses the usual “PC-1 form” procedure – a protective mechanism, which even if inadequate, was devised to prevent waste through haste.
Pakistan needs sober and reasoned education planning, not fantasy. Yes, we do need foreign assistance to build up a working higher education system. But a realistic and modest course of action with real chances of success would have to be designed differently. We should initially aim for, at the very most, two properly planned new engineering universities under the collective authority of the European Union. We also need external help for adding engineering departments to existing universities, and to massively upgrade existing ones. It is still not too late to ask for this.
The writer teaches physics at Quaid-i-Azam University, Islamabad.
pervezhoodbhoy@yahoo.com
HEC’s unconvincing mega projects
By Pervez Hoodbhoy
THE on-going efforts at reforming higher education are turning into a disaster. Billions are being spent on mindless mega projects. The 15-fold increase in the funding of Pakistani universities over the last six years may have delivered a marginal improvement, but it is superficial and likely to be temporary.
These facts are the subject of a researched article, “In Pakistan, the Problems That Money Can Bring”, published in the January 2007 issue of the well-respected New York based Chronicle of Higher Education. The Chronicle notes that in Pakistan the failure of the HEC (Higher Education Commission) to create and adequately implement rules has caused an explosion of substandard universities, fake and substandard degrees, meaningless research publications and a massive wave of unpunished plagiarised academic papers.
More grand folly is in the works. Among the government’s most expensive projects are the nine new engineering universities to be spread across the country. Officially associated with France, Sweden, Italy, Austria, Germany, Japan, as well as other countries, these universities are supposed to meet the acute shortage in Pakistan of international quality engineering education. Contrary to the general impression that these are foreign funded, in fact 100 per cent of the development, recurrent and salary costs will be paid for by Pakistan. This would be okay if the basic ingredients for success were there. They are not.
First, there are far too few qualified Pakistanis who can teach modern engineering subjects at an international professional level. There may be no more than two to three dozen suitable engineering professors in all of Pakistan’s engineering universities. This is a tiny fraction needed by the Rs 26 billion French University (the proposed name is UESTP-France@Karachi) which will eventually require 600 qualified Pakistani Ph.D teachers. The Rs 37 billion Pak-Swedish University, to be located in Sialkot, will need even more. Add more universities (Italy, Austria, Japan…), and you begin to glimpse the scale of the problem!
Looking for so many Pakistani engineering professors living abroad will not help. A national and international search by the upcoming LUMS School of Science and Engineering has – after two years of intensive effort – netted less than a dozen suitable future faculty members, with perhaps another dozen or two in the pipeline. This is despite LUMS’ good reputation and the very high salaries it has offered. Nothing can change the simple fact that Pakistanis in science and engineering subjects, whether at home or abroad, are far too few in numbers.
So, does the answer lie in sending thousands of Pakistanis to the West for a Ph.D in engineering or science and then waiting a few years? This route, while superficially attractive, also has serious difficulties. Foreign training is expensive. Many will not return, some because they did not succeed and others because they succeeded too well.One also fears that many of the ones who do return after completing their Ph.Ds would not have really mastered their respective disciplines. Approximately, a thousand Pakistanis sent recently to European universities have been selected on the basis of a rather trivial locally made numeracy and literacy test. International level tests were not required of students sent to Europe. (But, in a public declaration of its state of confusion and muddle-headedness, the HEC has placed advertisements in national newspapers formally requiring the authentic, but more difficult, international GRE subject test for registration into the Ph.D programmes of Pakistani universities!)
Visiting teams of European professors interviewed Pakistani students but, according to the students I have talked to, these were generally rather perfunctory. For whatever reasons, these teams were apparently softer than normal when selecting Pakistanis. This unfortunately means that Pakistanis returning from European universities will not be as good as others who have studied at the same universities.
So, what about hiring a European teaching faculty? Plans say that the heads of the new engineering universities will be professors from the EU countries, and Europeans will constitute five to 10 per cent of the total faculty strength. Let us set aside for the moment that Pakistan will pay the visiting European professors EU level salaries (with a 40 per cent mark-up to cover other expenses). The question still remains whether these professors will be accomplished teachers or researchers, or whether they are second-raters in their own countries.
Past experience of bringing faculty from abroad has not been good. There is scarcely a white European or American to be found in any Pakistani university. Huge salaries paid under the HEC’s four-year old foreign faculty programme has brought to Pakistan a handful of good dedicated professionals on contract appointments. They are guiding students, teaching and doing research. But the overwhelming majority of the foreign faculty comprises academic mercenaries from Russia, Ukraine, the Central Asian republics, as well as expatriate Pakistanis. They have little interest beyond the pecuniary.
The reliance on European faculty for Pak-European universities is obviously critical. But, according to French sources, as of early February 2007, no French vice-chancellor or faculty member has yet been appointed. (Pak-French will be followed by Pak-Sweden in 2008 and then other universities). Nevertheless, teaching officially starts in 2007. This bespeaks a planning disaster of grand proportions.
Worse may lie ahead. Suicide attacks within Pakistan are now averaging two a week or more. Will this discourage long-term European faculty in residence? How many professionally active foreign scientists and engineers will opt for a life under barricades and armed guards in places like Sialkot, Multan or Khairpur?
These are daunting conditions for developing higher education in Pakistan – for any policymaker. The problems are many, not just that of adequate faculty for the nine engineering universities. For example, the tens of thousands of academically well-equipped, entry-level students, who would constitute the input into the Pak-European universities, will not be available for many years. This would be true even if things start going perfectly well as of today.
Whim dominates planning. The HEC’s urge to constantly trumpet victory is moving higher education away from the path of the patient and careful academic development that it needs. Various products of an unconstrained imagination, such as the nine Pak-European universities, have been approved without a proper feasibility study. Senior government officers, whose duty it is to guard public finances, have surrendered under fear and political pressure.
In any country that abides by the basic principles of governance, this would surely be sufficient reason for a public inquiry. The planning commission and the finance ministry are said to have already released hundreds of millions of rupees for the Pak-European university project on the basis of a skimpy two-page “concept paper”. This bypasses the usual “PC-1 form” procedure – a protective mechanism, which even if inadequate, was devised to prevent waste through haste.
Pakistan needs sober and reasoned education planning, not fantasy. Yes, we do need foreign assistance to build up a working higher education system. But a realistic and modest course of action with real chances of success would have to be designed differently. We should initially aim for, at the very most, two properly planned new engineering universities under the collective authority of the European Union. We also need external help for adding engineering departments to existing universities, and to massively upgrade existing ones. It is still not too late to ask for this.
The writer teaches physics at Quaid-i-Azam University, Islamabad.
pervezhoodbhoy@yahoo.com
VIEW: Bring HEC back to earth —Pervez Hoodbhoy
http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=..._3-3-2007_pg3_2
http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=..._3-3-2007_pg3_2
I think Dr. Pervez is being a bit too much cynical. If you go to US you would find enough people who are not satisfied with system of education and i m sure same holds true for anyother country.
The best thing this govt is done is, they have tried to establish center of excellence and tried to improve human resource area of Pakistan. This clearly links to our industrial and technological development and biggest hurdle to foriegn investment in high tech sector. Almost all govts have restricted themselves to total literacy rate thinking and it's figures without paying too much attention to education interms of growth needs.
If these guys can pull this off and these nine universties start contributing to R&D then that would go a long way in helping our industrial and technological growth.
The best thing this govt is done is, they have tried to establish center of excellence and tried to improve human resource area of Pakistan. This clearly links to our industrial and technological development and biggest hurdle to foriegn investment in high tech sector. Almost all govts have restricted themselves to total literacy rate thinking and it's figures without paying too much attention to education interms of growth needs.
If these guys can pull this off and these nine universties start contributing to R&D then that would go a long way in helping our industrial and technological growth.
Yes I agree maglomanic.
However I think the voices of the skeptics must be taken into consideration and there must be a greater amount of transparency in this program....after all.....such big projects come with big opportunity costs....these are large sums of money we are talking about here.....so it must be made clear that there is a fully planned vision and concrete progress and achievable goals.
This is especially important in a country like Pakistan that is at a crucial time in its juncture regarding its economy.
Every dollar spent will affect millions of potential dollars further down the line of production and wealth. Put in the fact that this is a long term investment with multi branch multiplier effects.....and I am slightly worried that there have not been more calls for transparency of this project.
However I think the voices of the skeptics must be taken into consideration and there must be a greater amount of transparency in this program....after all.....such big projects come with big opportunity costs....these are large sums of money we are talking about here.....so it must be made clear that there is a fully planned vision and concrete progress and achievable goals.
This is especially important in a country like Pakistan that is at a crucial time in its juncture regarding its economy.
Every dollar spent will affect millions of potential dollars further down the line of production and wealth. Put in the fact that this is a long term investment with multi branch multiplier effects.....and I am slightly worried that there have not been more calls for transparency of this project.
Well Dr. Pervez is renowned columnist and physicist so we cant dismiss his conerns as merely cynical .
The thing is that if GOP is spending so much on Higher education they must ensure that the money is well spent.
But where i mostly disagree is regarding GRE which is not aknowlege based test but aptitude test . It will surely shore up quality becuase mostly peole rise up only to the challanges they face. Also the forgien returned students will bring in lot of improvement but the amount of improvemennt will surely depend upon the kind of people chosen
The thing is that if GOP is spending so much on Higher education they must ensure that the money is well spent.
But where i mostly disagree is regarding GRE which is not aknowlege based test but aptitude test . It will surely shore up quality becuase mostly peole rise up only to the challanges they face. Also the forgien returned students will bring in lot of improvement but the amount of improvemennt will surely depend upon the kind of people chosen
Developing good educational istitutes takes a long time. Hellraiser made a point, until we have standards all the way through nothing is going to be achieved. We need good education at school and college level, good behavioural and study standards set. Basic things like, attendance and meeting deadlines has to become a norm within society.
After that you can get students at uni, who are there to study. We hve to offer more pos grad insentives, and have a larger number of people teaching/researching at universities. We have to have researh insititutes and we have to get invovled in internatianl level competition. These research insititues need money to drive them.
All this takes time, can't be done overnight.
After that you can get students at uni, who are there to study. We hve to offer more pos grad insentives, and have a larger number of people teaching/researching at universities. We have to have researh insititutes and we have to get invovled in internatianl level competition. These research insititues need money to drive them.
All this takes time, can't be done overnight.
I think the basic idea is to first have enough universities. Once the universities are there, they can be made to match international standards.
For instance, there have been many universities/institutes operating in small houses in urban cities. Now, HEC says that soon, only degrees from those universities having their own campus/building will have recognized programme degree.
I think this is the good way to do things and Hoodbhoy is just a pessimist.
For instance, there have been many universities/institutes operating in small houses in urban cities. Now, HEC says that soon, only degrees from those universities having their own campus/building will have recognized programme degree.
I think this is the good way to do things and Hoodbhoy is just a pessimist.
QUOTE(Krad @ Mar 3 2007, 09:51 PM) [snapback]871642[/snapback]
Yes I agree maglomanic.
However I think the voices of the skeptics must be taken into consideration and there must be a greater amount of transparency in this program....after all.....such big projects come with big opportunity costs....these are large sums of money we are talking about here.....so it must be made clear that there is a fully planned vision and concrete progress and achievable goals.
This is especially important in a country like Pakistan that is at a crucial time in its juncture regarding its economy.
Every dollar spent will affect millions of potential dollars further down the line of production and wealth. Put in the fact that this is a long term investment with multi branch multiplier effects.....and I am slightly worried that there have not been more calls for transparency of this project.
Thats true. To tell you the truth i am his(Dr Houdbhai) biggest supporter as well. He has left all the opportunities he could have availed and came back to teach.
But sometimes he just shows the kind of pessimism which is totally counter productive. None the less he has every right to say what he wants to and debate each and every aspect of govt policies.
Pakistan already has some good universties and that didn't require lots of foriegners and PhDs from aborad to establish. Even an oversight board linked to foriegn universities that oversees policy making and their implementation would do the trick while we can have qualified teachers from pakistan. You don't need every teacher to be PhD. Research and that too on very realistic implementable research which could help industry should be the priority. From then on it's all about getting down to the business and getting your hands dirty. That would however require financial support of govt in a long run.
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