你们好！

我是瑞典人！ 我对中国很感兴趣。所以我努力学习中文。 我非常喜欢讨论政治。但是在中国很难讨论政治。中国政府不尊重人权。不允许自由的讨论。巴基斯坦也不太尊重人权。但是好像没有中国的那么坏。
一个中国朋友告诉我在这个论坛有中国人。可以在这儿跟他们讨论中国政治。所以我想问在这儿的中国朋友们，你们对独裁有什么看法？你们对台湾的民主注意制度有什么看法？对中国政府压迫藏族和维吾尔族有什么看法？

我很佩服达赖喇嘛。但是中国大陆论坛不允许我讨论达赖喇嘛的课题？ 中国当局为什么那么害怕这种课题吗？

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Translation:

Hello! I am a Swede! I am interested very much to China. Therefore I diligently study Chinese. I extremely like discussing politics. But is very difficult in China to discuss politics. Chinese government respect for human right. Does not permit the free discussion. Pakistan not too respect for human right. But looks like does not have China to be that bad. A Chinese friend tells me to have the Chinese at this forum. May discuss the Chinese politics in here with them. Therefore I want to ask in here Chinese friends, what view you has to the dictatorship? What view do you have to Taiwan's democracy attention system? Oppresses Tibetan nationality and Uygur national minority what view to the Chinese government has? I admire Dalai Lama very much. But mainland China forum does not allow me to discuss Dalai Lama's topic? Why is the Chinese authority that afraid this kind of topic?

Hi welcome to the forum. what about American human rights?

Thanks for your welcome!

At least you can discuss human rights in USA. Many Americans criticize Bush. But why is China so afraid of free discussion? How many Chinese newspapers criticize Hu Jintao?

The only thing I can say in defence about the human rights in china is that with population of nearly 1.5 Billion, you got to break a few eggs to make an omelette. I think that just about sums it up. taa

welcome to PDF

So China is nothing but an omelette?

中国只不过是一个煎蛋卷吗？

Flabbergasted? Or did I just caught you short intellectually? “It is wiser to find out than to suppose”

Breaking eggs is just a figure of speech man . No need to sarcastic, come and join the fun inside.

Flabbergasted? Or did I just caught you short intellectually? “It is wiser to find out than to suppose”

Breaking eggs is just a figure of speech man . No need to be sarcastic, come and join the fun inside.

Hi Yuebaili, Welcome to the forum.

Let's try to keep the Chinese language or China-related topics in the China Thread out of respect for our Pakistani friends here. This is after all, still a Pakistani forum, so let's keep the China related threads in one place. Thanks.

Sorry!

I was not so familiar with the forum. I did not know about the China thread.

你好，如果如你所说你是瑞典人，那你的中文的确学的不错！以下内容也应该看的懂
“中国政府不尊重人权。不允许自由的讨论。”请问阁下在中国生活多少年？我们伟大的领袖——毛泽东有句名言：“没有调查就没有发言权”！请阁下有时间到我们的军事论坛去看看实际情况，谢谢！
请不要以西方的思维来思考东方事务！请阁下弄清楚一个问题：一党执政!=独裁！！中国政府代表的是中国人民的利益
台湾是中华人民共和国的不可分割的领土！！总有一天她会回到祖国的怀抱，台湾问题是中国内政无需你们指手画脚谢谢！
中华56个民族是友好相处，同舟共济，阁下何时看到“中国政府压迫藏族和维吾尔族”？但是任何反华势力必将受到严厉的惩罚和无情的打击！

“人不犯我，我不犯人，人若犯我，必不饶人”请阁下不要庸人自扰，管好自己本国的事情，我们中国的事情无需你们劳神。犯我中华者，虽远必诛！！时代变了，中国已经不是以前的中国，她会更加强大更加富强，成为维护世界和平不可忽略的力量！！！！！！！！！

Excuse me who are you!
What I want to tell y is that you have no qualification to criticize my matherland China!!

请阁下注意言辞！你没有资格对中国妄加评论！ 无耻的败类（如果你是中国人的话）

starter of this thread,

i am wondering whether you have been to china or not, or most information you have about china is from western medias? comparing with western world, i agree that china's political mechanism is less democratic, as you all know that china is a socialistic country. communist party of china is always the ruling party, which boasts over 100 million party members nationwide. with this system, we are facing more and more problems such as corruption, critiques on human rights from so-called democratic countries, and even boycott. but why? those are our own problems, are we damaging other countries' interests? of course not. which concern them most is the considerably increasing economic and military power of china in recent years.

as for taiwan and dalai lama, in my point of view, it has nothing to do with democracy, but a matter of unification of china. do you know how much china has invested in tibet since Qing dynasty? do you know how many treasures and cultural relics kmt government has taken to taiwan during 1945-1949? no one in china would like to see taiwan or tibet separated from china, and i think no matter who the president of china is, he dares not bear the responsibility of losing taiwan, or independence of any provinces. that's why we never promise to abandan military solutions, i am definitely sure that over 90% of chinese people support the central government in country unification issues. it may be hard for western people to understand, but it is the truth.

i am just an ordinary citizen in china, and not a communist party member. but i can assure you that our government didn't and will not suppress tibet or xinjiang people. on the contrary, the government grants the minorities numerous preferential policies. just take birth control for example, minority families can have as more children as they want, but han-nationality can't. we can only have one, just becasue they are minorities. to be frank, minorities in china are spoiled, they have been enjoying too much.

just stop here for the time being, since you are good at chinese, i suggest you take time to visit a chinese forum at http://cache.tianya.cn/publicforum/Article...worldlook.shtml, maybe you can learn a little more about what chinese ordinary people are talking about online.

You are of course entitled to have your opinion. I have my opinion,which is different from yours. This is what makes discussions interesting. Unfortunately it is my impression that many Chinese people are too stupid (or brainwashed) to understand this.

When I have tried to express my opinion about democracy, Tibetan and Xinjiang independence in Chinese forums, my posts have always been deleted. So I can understand that those people understand that they have no good arguments against me.

Is the forum you suggest, a forum where my arguments will be met with other arguments instead that my post will be deleted? In that case I will give it a try. But I am fed up with stupid Chinese communist propaganda.

since i've seen you are good in Chinese,i'd like to recommend you this article,
to let you know why did Chinese Communist Party must kick Dalai Lama's arse

http://www.pkuer.net/wmkj/jiaxiang/XiZang/6/23.htm

the author is an Swiss chinese and all the references of his article is western tibit experts who lived in tibit for few decades.

anyway, bro i kinda agree with you that some chinese people is stupid, but that's why we don't need western style " freedom of speech" recentlly, cuz they can't judge right and wrong themeslves and easy to be misguided, that's why we don't need "western style democracy" now.

my 2 cents.

you can scan the forum first before you post threads there.

it is ridiculous that you deem chinese people stupid or brainwashed. first, chinese is one of the smartest peoples in the world, others include jewish, japanese. secondly, chinese people USED TO be brainwashed by communism, as what is still happening in north korea, but as we were open to the outside world as from 1980s, most of chinese people have realized that we are far behind the 'DECAYED CAPITALISM'. do you know how many internet users there are in china? over 100 million. we are enjoying more and more freedom to speak, to reveal, even to criticize the central government now. the new president Hu Jintao and the premier Wen Jiabao are very popular among the young people, they are quite down-to-earth and concerned about the welfare of common people. better than their predecessors. in some remote places, it is possible that people know little about democracy or autarchy, they don't care about it, since the major problem for them is to make ends meet first. are they brainwashed? no, i don't think so, it is just out of poverty or poor-education. but things are getting better.

you may know that china has been implementing economical reforms since 1979, more and more former state-owned enterprises were sold or turned into holding companies. as far as i know, nowadays, there are no more than 200 state-owned companies left in china. i am from guangdong province, in southern china, to some extent the governments and people are influenced by the political mechanism of hong kong. living standards are improving, more and more families can afford spacious apartments, cars and traveling abroad, which we couldn't imagine some 20 years ago.

ok, maybe i am so brainwashed that i know nothing about the heavenly democracy, but i know my salary is raised by 20% this year and i just bought my second apartment. to hell with democracy and autarchy.

almost forget about dalai lama, actually the central government announced publically that he will be welcome to discuss any issues except for tibet independence, but got no response from him. dalai lama is a traitor, what he wants is to be the religious leader of tibet, do you really think he will implement democracy? i think he will be a dictator.

just out of curiosity, or maybe you are brainwashed too? by the 'democratic' propaganda against china? just come to have a look by yourself, china is a very beautiful country.

With all due respect, I think you don't know enough about China to be judging like this. Stop applying Western standards upon China, China's situation is not like the West.

Also, you are not aware about many facts regarding Tibet and other issues. If you think the Dalai Lama is a saint, read these articles.

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?t...153c83b5ef21c7f

You said you have been to China before? I am curious how long? Because it is hard to believe someone who has had so much experience learning Chinese and travelling in China can have such a bad misunderstanding of the country.

There are stupid and smart people of of all nationalities. I don´t think Chinese people are more stupid than Americans who elected Bush for president. It would be very interesting to see how Chinese people woud vote if they had the chance. But then of course they must first have the oportunity to listen to arguments of different political parties -not only communist propaganda.

I will not accept any restrictions about what to discuss. So there is nothing for me to do in narrowminded Chinese forums. And I don´t think Dalai Lama or anyone should accept any restrictions as for what to discuss either.

I am not surprised you think Dalai Lama will be a dictator, as you seem to listen uncritically to communist propaganda.

I visited Jilin one month in june 2001. (I spent most of the time in Jilin city and Changchun. But I also visited Changbaishan, which was most fascinating - beautiful, and the thought of being so close to the horrible N. Korean dictatorship, that I could see it with my own eyes)

Anyway, one day in Jilin I began to discuss with some people in the street about Dalai Lama. They told me he was a traitor and a separatist. I asked them from where they had that information, and told them Dalai Lai Lama had said he was not seeking Tibetan independence. So I advised them to be more critical towards communist propaganda. As the discussion went on, more and more people gathered around us. At last one person told me I should stop, because it could be dangerous for me to continue. I believe it was a friendly advise. So I stopped.

I don´t believe Dalai Lama is a saint. But I believe he should be allowed to express his opinion directly to the chinese people, instead of being slandered by CCP without possibility to defend himself.

I have visited China many times since the first time in 1985. But unfortunately never longer than 1 month. OTOH I have visited more different parts of China than most Chinese - Xinjiang, Yunnan, Guangdong, Jilin....

But I am dreaming of staying in China for a longer time. I have heard there is great demand for English teachers. So maybe I could work as an English teacher, even if my mother tongue is not English. That would give me many oportunities to discuss politics. But OTOH I want to do it in Chinese.

希望搂主到中国来看看再下结论，不论你是瑞典人还是日本人，印度人，美国人.........

Boring,I don't care what form of government is. The most important thing is peace .And to most people is how to make them not hugry ,cold. Mybe many year in the future all chinese will seat down and talk about Polity . If you regard us as fool ,you must the most foolish one . when you are hugry ,what you do first ? when all your people no food ,no job and no place to sleep,they will all discuss sweden polity ?
BTW , just for a joke .If I 'm the chief of PRC and chinese is stronger as USA . I would like to talk abot polity with you by million of PLA on your land____ That's the kind of polity that Swedes talk to china in hundred years ago.

:ChineseFlag:

中国的朋友请加ＱＱ群：15071646，努力拉人啊．～～！！

Well，here I am again.
I hope Pakistan will continue the democratic way. And also put pressure on China to become democratic.

Welcome back

Which democratic way are you referring to?

The way the ancient Greeks suppressed non-Whites and gave minorcomplexes within their own White people and non-white?

Or...

The way Descartes, Montesqiue, John Locke etc etc wanted democracy to become innovative and not by looking back on the mistakes of the ancestors?

E.g. Human Rights were declared (funny enough, no poor people and woman were not a part of that) where, Freedom of Speech was before limited because the king and the church were one, now the compromise and promise was that you may be a Christian or whatsoever - but politics and religion will not inteferre each other - at no price.

Because Sir, you live in Sweden and I live in Denmark, we are 'democratic' neighbours geographically speaking but, are you more democratic than me than I am to you? Based upon my knowlegde on democracy and I've written a BA-project on Democracy - does it mean I am more democratic than you and I can give you more minor complexes according the Democratic procedure of the Ancient Greeks...?

Sir, this abovementioned example is the same thing as the Democracy is at the moment, it has been misused and politically raped by politicians in co-operation with the media. Imagine China being democratic, which I will favor and will work for but, is China going to get the same status as the West? same respect? If the Chinese fully criticize and try to put a strong foothold on global issues upon Chinese interests and call it global democracy?

Look to the West, open your eyes, who are these countrymen which are democratic? Whitemen! They have the political-formula on how to avoid civilwars, anti-corruption, good welfare socities etc etc etc and are I-counties - which are obligated to help the u-countries, which at the moment isn't going nowhere because no one is going to share that political-formula to create a peaceful world-agenda!
Chinese aren't white with blueeyes and blondehair.... they have never been and never will be which is part of Ancient Greek Democracy - that is racism and discrimination. It's a White World!
Democracy is to suppress the East by looking down on the colour, race or religious background, on a global scale.
E.g. the ruler in a Eastern country is a dictator in the West - even if that 'dictator' has been / is a slave for it's country - by means working for it's future. Just like the Ancient Greeks did.

Even if China becomes Democratic, no one is going to care about it because money talks. That's the whole issue that some has political minor complexes that a 'Communistic - anti-humanrights - China' has become the richest country in gold-reserves and economical boosts!

Another e.g. the whole main issue Pakistan is going through a hell is because of nuclear power, weapons, arsenal etc etc. Someone does not want PK to be a nuclear arsenal therefore you weaken the enemy by creating internal problems -make it down on your knees.

Peace

thank you for caring about china, but i think china today has some other problems which are more important to deal with!

Of course not!
I know too little about Pakistan. But I am refering to what I think and hope is a democratic trend. Musharraf definitely was a dictator. At least now there has been elections. Although Benazir Bhutto was killed, her democratic ideas seem to have support among a majority of Pakistanis. I am convinced that freedom of speech will serve the interests of Pakistan.

I have to admit that a lot of what you have written I do not understand (Jeg har boet i Danmark, så det er mulig jeg ville forstå bedre hvis du kunne udtrykke det på dansk). E.g. "Because Sir, you live in Sweden and I live in Denmark, we are 'democratic' neighbours geographically speaking but, are you more democratic than me than I am to you?" Do you mean there are any important democratic differences between Sweden and Denmark?

Ok, det er braa hehe :-)
Sorry mate, if I wrote in Danish I wouldn't be able to aim the larger group which reads posts on PDF.

Yes. There are differences in every country about the political setting. You and I, many others know how the political setting is regarding people with ethnical background, and Sweden is much more friendlier towards other ethnical minorities than DK - but things are changing in Sweden.

The part where I deepen the question on identical issue of democracy comes to life when I mention the BA-project in my first post on how Democratic someone is - if one person was able to rank it. That's just it.

The point is how, democratic are we and the ability to know about Democracy from A-Z, rather than going and talking/following blindly the politicians, the media and other anti-Eastern elements in general before concluding Democracy is the best solution. My advice is to You that, read historical books, philosophy, social barriers etc of the Ancient Greeks and compare it with the era of renaissance and modern enlightment.
Finally compare both of them to global state we are living in now e.g. Sweden/Denmark and globally.

Yes, Benazir Bhutto died, which was sad and we can't sit and cry forever. It was a shock but, life goes on. I hope someone understood lesson to avoid such thing again.

Musharraf might be/is/isn't a dictator but, compare what his governtment has contributed with other former governments.
Every government has had minus and pluss on it's account as whole.
Freedom of speech is the last Pakistan needs - we need education-, healthcare-, taxation-, social-, welfare- and organised system. Read all about organization theories and then you'll understand.

There are other things which are far more important in life than talking like a politician.
Live, sit, talk and walk with people and you will discover a world where no politician has been to before. Why you think? Because they do not want to loose national votes and disappoint the senators in US.


Men ha' det braa kompis eller kære ven :-)

Peace=Fred

You write "we need education", so I suppose you are Pakistani yourself. And you can compare Denmark and Pakistan.
I lived in Denmark 1970-1979 (maybe you were not even born).So at least I can compare Denmark and Sweden.

When I first came to Denmark, my impression of danes was that they were very tolerant and openminded. At least compared to what I was used to in Sweden. So I am very surprised that today Danes belong to the most xenophobic among Europeans. Besides Sweden has a lot more immigrants than Denmark,so we should have more reason to be xenophobic. I have wondered about the reason for this.
But then I remember one aspect where i found Danes more intolerant than Swedes already in 1970. That was about Germans. Of course we never were occupied by Germany. But in 1970 lots of Danes could still remember the occupation. And on the Danish west coast rich Germans were buying summerhouses that danes could not afford to buy. So Denmark being a small country felt threatened by the big neighbour. My theory is that today the Muslims have taken the place of Germany as the biggest threat against Danish identity. I am interested to know whether you agree.

Actually there are a lot of things I would like to discuss. I hope we can continue to do so. But to start with, I would like to know why you say the last thing Pakistan needs is freedom of speech. Do you think freedom of speech could hurt Pakistan? Why? What do you think about the freedom of speech that we have in Scandinavia?

(1) Yours is a so-called 'free' country. So abolish ur strict immigration law. People of all races should be allowed to enter/leave ur country freely.

(2) Yours is a country where the so-called 'human rights' come atop everything else. So stop attacking the Bosnian refugees. The right-wing thugs should be sternly dealt with.

(3) Yours is a country where the wills of the ethnic minority is most respected. So Set free the Lapps so that these people can have their own country.

(4) Your so-called constitutional monarchy sucks and it is not demoractic. It should be abolished for good.

(5) You should also examine your expansionist history and keep apologizing to the Norwegians, the Danes, the Russians and other people in the Baltic region in general, till such time that the modern Swedes are assimilated into the other races.

There isn't any freeedom of speech anywhere in this world.
if law of physics were not to play a vital role then, I'm sure that Neil Armstrong would have testified that he could hear the expression in approach of scream and cry of injustice happening in the 1960's on the moon and outer space. And today we are in 2008, so imagine the headache someone would go through if not the law of physics played that role.

If your own child said father, f**k you, you would slap him! If you said that to your own employee, you will get sacked.
If you said that against the royal couple in any monoarchistic country you would get fined and jailed.
It is limited, everyone knows that.
Freedom of speech is not what Pakistan needs, which I state with full confident. Sir, just read organization theoriesand economical theories, then you'll understand it's the economical circuit which needs to get boosted and thus creating more pressure on education institution which will learn e.g. law in the faculties etc etc.... so that's last thing we need to focus on.
If I spoke against the govt. in Denmark, I would be bluestamped as a traitor, right-oriented Muslim, which the media would cover and deamonise me because they are tools of the govt.

My opinion is think critical to everything the media and the govt claims.


Muslims who have taken the identity of Germany against the Danes? At that time Germans were in general Nazis and had their agenda.
E.g. if I said American senators have taken the positon of Germany against the East, then yes. Because I am within the political limit of not hurting anyone with ethnical background or religious belief. So comparing Nazigermany with Muslims, isn't a good idea.

I am a Muslim, borned, raised, living and will die as one, if someone has got any problems then live with it - i will not give up my identity. And as a Muslim, I swear in the Name of Allah, the Merciful and Beneficent and His Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) I would have given up on my religion if it was as non-peaceful and violent religion according to the media, govt. and people but, I haven't because it's the opposite of their biased statements.

I'd rather live in a country like China where there are no human rights at all - rather than living in a socalled 'liberal' country where there are 'superficial' laws for the individual's protection, which do not exist.
Read my first post then you'll understand.

In the 70th there were very few Germans with Nazi agenda. I also believe the majority of Danish Muslims have no hostile agenda towards Denmark. And they enjoy the respect of Danish society. One famous example is the politician Naser Khader.
But I cannot understand,if you are so unsatisfied with the Danish political system,why are you still staying in Denmark? Do you have the ambition to make Denmark a Muslim country?

1970 and 1945 are different times, which you did not mention in your earlier post which also mislead me into replying you best as possible. So please remember to post in details of what you are about to say. Yes, then you are regarding the Germany-issue.

Naser Khader was a person with ethnical background which was used against the minority and now the govt and politicians have backstabbed him due to he isn't that important any longer. Even non-Muslims can see the picture.

I am not unsatisfied with the Danish system, I love it, but politicaly I am against the propoganda the govt. preaches against minorities and I have a lot of non-Muslim Danish friends.

Do you have the ambition to make Denmark a Muslim country?
So have you bluestamped me already just because I am politically intested doesn't has to mean I have inflicted that with my religion.
Hahaha, so you think I am one of 'them' which the media and politicians have flamed so much about.

I am talking about the Western politics against China, while the West has it's own problems which it would never admit it has, and your post and questions says it all 'But I cannot understand,if you are so unsatisfied with the Danish political system,why are you still staying in Denmark?' where you instead could have been diplomatically and said 'govt. has created problems but , everyone has to work on it incl. the govt to fix the implented challenges.
And i did to mention the country where i live peacefully.
Yes, majority of Danish Muslims live, work, educate, socialise very good actually in Denmark but, when politicians and media inflicts the development, everyone faces a lot of challenges!

The real winners are extremists who gain more supporters and become stronger. E.g. numbers of nazis and racists have exploded - even hatecrimes. And Muslims which haven't understood the religion as whole, have gained more advertisment through the media. This also creates more hatred towards the religion, Muslims and vice-versa.
It'll create a greater cliff between 'us' and 'them' which isn't what people in any society needs!
And no, there isn't any reason of making the country a Muslim country - which I do no support.

Good!
In a democracy you are allowed to criticize the government.
Do you think this system would be good for Pakistan too?

As for the west never admitting its problems, I definitely think this is not correct. Do you never read Danish newspapers?

But if you read Chinese newspapers you will easily get the impression that what the Chinese government is doing is very good. I do not know, but I believe it was the same in Pakistan during Musharraf dictatorship.

Hello yuebai.

Welcome to the PDF. I hope you have a nice stay. It's very nice to hear that you you are interested in China.


Do you mean you are a swedish born Chinese ? or a native swedish person ?

Thanks

But ask senior members on this forum who have been discussing and are experts on Pakistan's internal issues.
Yes, the media in Pakistan has gained liberty - reporting 24 hours against every politicians in the opposition or the govt - this has stood under Musharrafs regime (from 2001 and forth) and not before that.
There are various Chinese newspapers so can't say which is pro-govt or not.

The West will never admit it's problems which have been created due to their interests.

E.g. UK had whole India under it's power and colony. Jinnah (founder of Pakistan) gave the trust to Lord Mountbatten (a white British official) regarding the issue of Kashmir, which he did not succeed. No govt. officials from the Upper House and House of Lords in UK are going to admit the deep problems created after 1947 in the region due to Lord Mountbattans failure.

That's the same for Palestine, Iraq and other African nations.
Only country which apologised was France to Algeria for it's cruelty during the colony-period.

Enough said from me - try to discuss with others on this forum.

Peace.

China is very serious on National dignity and sovereignty.

I think you should know the histoy of China between 1840-1976, you should know the reason.

The more the Westerners support Tibetan independnece, the more is the Han Chinese (also Korean Chinese, Hui people, Manchus, Zhaung, Miao / Hmong) support CCP.

We allow other to critize the Human right of China, but don't allow to suspect our sovereignty.

大概没有独立思想能力的汉族的反应会这样。但是我怀疑少数民族的反应会这样。譬如朝鲜族对中国支持朝鲜独裁很不满意。没有中国，韩国就是一个国家。汉族对朝鲜族的态度也不好。朝鲜族认为白头山是他么的。汉族骂朝鲜族。我在天涯看了很多这样的帖子。汉族民族主义太极端。

I suppose this is the reaktion of Han people who are unable to think independently. But I doubt the minorities will react like that. E.g. the Koreans are very unsatisfied with the Chinese support for the N.Korea dictatorship. If it was not for China, then Korea would be a united country. The way Hans behave towards Koreans is also very bad. Koreans think Paektusan belongs to them. Hans are cursing them. I read a lot of such posts at Tianya forum. The nationalism of Han people is too extreme.

Anyway, Korean Chinese (朝鲜族) consider themselves as Chinese first.

Korean (not 朝鲜族) wants to claim our Manchuria (North East).

Japanese wants to claims our Taiwan.

Indian wants to claims our Tibet.

We don't accept this.

English: Koreans

Chinese: 朝鲜族

没关系他们是吉林的或者汉城的。他们见面就说韩语。他们愿意同一。中国使他们分离。
台湾人愿意继续跟中国分离。中国准备用暴力使他们同一。


Whether they come from Jilin or Seul, they will speak Korean when they meet. They wish to be united but China separated them.

Compare with Taiwanese who wish to be separated. But China is prepared to use violence to unite them with China.

Their homeland is Korea,Manchuria is not their homeland,they just settle into this region less than 100 years

1. 統一 (Reunification)，不是同一

2. 吉林 is none of business of Korea. (There does not exist the problem Reunification of 吉林 and Korea, 吉林 is Manchus place not Korean homeland, please don't insult China.)

3. sahaliyan is ethnic Manchus 滿族, he can represent ethnic Manchus to talk about the relation among Han, Manchus and Korea. (He and I are member of Uyghur Online forum.)

1. Thanks!
2. I was thinking of the unifikation of North and South Korea.
3. I try to register there. But I keep getting the message 您刷新得太快了，请1秒以后再访问! Did I do something wrong?

Hello:
I'm glad you are here so we can save you out from all those western propagandas. Yes indeed it's hard to talk about your typical western style politics in China because Chineses had been fed up with those ideas long ago.
Let me tell you one thing, when chinese are listening to CCP progaganda, they know it's propaganda. Unlike westerns blindly believe the CNN and that their capitalist style "democracy" and "freendom" is the only correct ideology in the world and it will benefit all human beings on earth. Indea is one solid counter example of the failure of democracy right there. You should try to see the world from our point of view 1st, then decide w/e you are going to say.

IN CHINESE CULTRUE WE HAVE NO SUCH A WORD SO CALLED DEMOCRACY. AND WE HAVE CONFUCIONS, NENCIOUS YOUR WESTERN NEVER HAD. NEVER PUSH UR FACKING DEMOCRACY TO OUR CHINESE.

IS DALAI LAMA ANY BUSINESS WITH YOUR WESTERN?

How did working as Nazi collaborators worked out for ya?

You are looked down upon because you are ignorant and yet you speak as if you are superior. You make up lies and try to sell it to us, then call us brainwashed when we expose your lies. Most of the Chinese posters here are oversea Chinese, and they had their share of "Western" education. You and your fellow retards came into discussions with an arrogant attitude like you are absolutely righteous. It's also why you are hated around the world.

Right off the bat you start accusing China as oppressive towards ethnic minorities in Xinjiang and Tibet, then you accuse us of being a dictatorship, and then you call the people as stupid and brainwashed. You are here to make accusations, not discussions. In short, you and your kinds are cocky douchebags.

there is no use to talk to an idiot who believe that Manchuria should be a part of korea. I'm just tired of all his bullsh*ts....

we chinese love the current system in China.. dont need anybody else tell us how to do.. stop your hypocritical expression.. democracy is by no means a perfect term. just one sort of forms to manage a country,not the only one, not the best one for every stage of development.

what does a nation mean? never based on the ethnics, creed or language, but the great land.
what does CHINESE mean? never means only Han ppl.
all Chinese share the same land no matter what kind of ehnics,creed or language you are!

ps. i also want to advocate sweden should embrace socialism. LOL....

Welcome to PDF

Atleast China doesn't go around other defence-less countries and killing millions and using nuclear weapons.

wow, the word "right" come out from an egoist:LOLANI: