for some years, say for last few years after the hindu exremist's govt BJP came to power in India to until to date indian military undergoing huge and hi tec weapon additions. i hear every week some new good weapon acquisitions by indian govt. last year alone they tested agni3 and so called missile defence. also bought huge t-90s and canon deal. after that we heard about carriers, nuclear submarine and slbm. after that huge iaf fighter deal for most advanced fighters in the world, huge chopper deal, pak fa. now i read they have advantages in space technologies!!!

are indians going for a war in near future? why so huge offensive military build up?

what is our govt doing?! where is mush? is he happy with just jf-17 and f-16??!!!

i request members to closely watch these and make a short good list what pa, paf and pn do and do not..

Pakistan is also preparing :)

AoA Bro.

I wouldn't worry too much on this if I were you

First of all, Pakistan is also upgrading to keep a minimum detterence against India.
Secondly, its not all about Pakistan. North for India the Chinese dragon is waking and to keep power in this region India surely needs to upgrade their forces too.

These two are what I think the primary reasons for why you shouldn't worry
Besides, they are on a buying spree, not everything has arriwed yet and nor will it. And in the time it will arrive, Pakistan will also get their new equipment.

With Salam and Regards /Shahid

Thats what our nukes are for... deterrence.

You cannot take these systems as an offensive approach! Without few like Agni-3, Agni-4, aircraft carrier, nuclear submarine and PAK FA all other systems are purely defensive. Thanx.

WE CAN TAKE!!

but for that we also have to take Pakistani weapons with the same approach!! But this is alll rubbish we are talking here!!

YOu're kidding right. You're asking us to basically ignore billion dollar acquisitions like multiple aircraft carriers and IRBMS and military doctrines like Cold Start and assume INdia is "defensive"?????????? It's obvious that India is trying to be a regional bully and is building up to extend its reach.


Pakistan will continue to monitor and expand as necessary.

No, I'm not kidding. I think you should note about India's defense deals before saying this. Pakistan have nothing to do with aircraft carriers, as India and Pakistan share a common border. India's Agni-1 (800 km) and Prithvi (350 km) can cover whole Pakistan so you dont need to worry about IRBMs and ICBMs. Cold start doctrine is just in experimental stage to modify Indian Army's mobility and strategic airlift capabilities. That also exists in Pakistan, so nothing new. The new frigates, submarines and destroyers of the Indian Navy can be effectively countered by F-22P and Milgem, so balance is there. JF-17, F-16 is more than capable to handle SU-30MKI and Mig-29. Mirage-IIIRose matches Jaguars, Mirage-2000. F-7PG are enough for LCA. J-10 will come to match MRCA. J-XX for PAK FA. PA is in better position than IA with AK is already better than T-90S as Arjun is not been inducted so far in large numbers. Cobra is better than old Mi-35.

So I see it almost matches. If India dont go for new weapons it will tilt the military balance of South Asia. Thats why we need nuke sub, Barak-NG, PAK FA, BMD, stealth frigates and space based recon and weapons.

Thanx.

YOU LY..too..much

India has more ambitions and is not confined to Pakistan, so we are acquiring these weapons and tech. Agni-3 is meant for China and agni-3plus and agni-4 and surya will be for China and west.

I think f-16 block-50,60 with aesa and amaraams will be more capable than the flankers, but Pakistan haven't got these f-16 block-50. As of now flankers are more agile and maneouvrable.

Regarding our nuclear subs they will be a potential threat to our enemies and they can't be countered so easily.

To start off we need to get rid of Indian presence in Afghanistan...

I think PA is fully aware of the fact. But one must take the big size of Indian territory. Then she also has history with China and Pakistan.

But as said by bojangles, we must do something for Indian consulates in Afghanistan because everybody knows how a dead horse, called BLA, got "Doosra Janam" after its First one.

that is correct. but how to do that? taliban? karzai is a indian dog.

shahid_2dk

brother, what you said is not correct. i do not think our mush not doing anything but what is he doing is not enough.

Titan_1984

only that much weapon india not buying. why you need satellite and pak fa? why you need carriers?


my list for pa.

buy 1000 heavy tank like m1a2 or leo2.
produce 200 155 mm canon with smart shell tot.
buy 150 attack choppers.
buy electrnic warfare and good aesa radars.

my list for paf.

buy 100 typhoon or rafale.
try to buy 50 f35.
120 kn sam.

my list for pn

buy one medium size carrier with 30 fighters
lease 2 nuclear submarines from china
buy 6 fremm class frigates
buy 3 054 from china
produce long range uav with aesa radar
build large landing ships to carry atleast 1500 army and 50 tanks.
ship carrying b missile.


india is gone..

Bro !

Seriously without being personal, get out of the dream bubble. There is no way Paf kan just go and pickup 100 Eurofighters or Rafales, nor there is any chance to get 50 f35 !! You forget that things aren't for free in this world.
Same goes for your other lists.

And did you read what I wrote fully? China, read the part about China again.

Bro something is realistic and something is a dreamworld. We don't need all that stuff, even though it would be nice to have.
What you are talking about aqcuiring is gonna cost billions and billions of dollars, what about the other sectors in our country? Education? Health? Roads? etc.

With Salam and Regards /Shahid

ZJoseph,

Realitic Lists please

Wars are not free of the factors that create them and propertuate them
the best defense is a stable homeland, so the enemy has nothing within to take advantage off

baring that,

we shoudl look at capabilities
what makes the typhoon so great (instead of the j-10) the meteor, the ASEA Radar, the ECCM, the sensor fusion
the chinese are making an aam to match the metor, they are working on an ASEA radar, eccm, and sensor fusion

but all this will be done cheaper, and with a supplier that will remain loyal

the jf-17 is a platform that has alot of room to be further developed, just look at the stealth design variants comming out in chinese defense magazines and forums

if india buys loads of tanks, counter it with troops armed with ATGMs like baktar shikran and hj-9, as well as advanced rpg-7 variants or even something like a javelin but cheap enough to give to the masses of troops, so they can repel an attack

also start to build IFVs from retiring t-59 hulls, sort of liek the israelis and even be able to sell them


but remeber to build up the nation, so all other options can be used (economic, political/diplomatic, etc.) to avoid war, or manage it if it happens (god forbid) to our benefit

build up clout as a nation to be respected

As Mr ZJoseph is saying or dreaming to buy so much weapons, India would be compelled to develop twice that capacity and this will trigger a mad arms race that will be too expensive atleast for Pakistan. I wonder if Pakistani economy can sustain such a race. As i have already said we are developing these capabilities because we have a global ambition and our coastlines and borders are so huge in comparison to Pakistan.

If Pakistan has a global ambition it should change its India centric mindset.

knock knock......wake up wake up.....!!!!

With that... Pakistan will even challenge china and USA !!!!

ok bro, i will reset my list,

pa

buy 500 heavy tank like m1a2 or leopard2
produce 100 155 mm canon from technology transfer from turkey
buy 100 attack choppers like apache from usa
buy new eltronic warfar and aesa lonh radars


my list for paf

buy 50 typhoon
buy 50 rafale
100 km sam

pn

buy one medium size carrier with 30 fighters like naval j-10
lease 1 nuclear submarine from china
buy 6 fremm frigates
buy 3 054
produce long range uav with aesa radar
build large landing ships to carry atleast 1500 army and 50 tanks.
ship carrying ballistic missile.

these weapons pakistan can buy for next 4 years.

i posted one more realistic list.

thank you for your comment. j-10 is a very capable fighter but still i think if we go for 50 typhoon and 50 rafale (usa will not sell f-35 to us). they will be much better. atleast our enemy will be frightened that typhoon and rafale coming. what you say?

no i am not dreaming pakistan can buy these much weapons. pakistan's economy is very strong. arms race? what you talking about? india buying much more weapons than my lists!!

bhindi listen your india is buying much more weapons than what i listed. i said 50 typhoons for paf but your country buying 126 of them! i said 50 rafales your country have 200 su-30! pakistan buying 40 j-10 your country buying pak fa?? why? you need so much weapons? let us buy these weapons first we will see you...china is much powerful country do not talk about them. but we will teach a lesson to india israel and usa. they often talk about attacking pakistan!

Yea, BLA is without a doubt an Indian created problem (thought it isn't much of a problem anymore).



Do what we did with Russia, except this time don't get people religiously motivated, but rather nationally motivated (for Pakistan).

lol.. i thought u dont reply to Indians...

Buddy... listen.India has a bigger neighbor and interest in South-Asia and i not remind u who and what that is every time. This is as per interest of India.

Secondly , India has not done justice to air force for a very long time..MiG21,23 and 27s are falling out of sky and soon need replacement. Now one a fast track its not possible to replace each fighter , so we induct high quality and performance jets and upgrade our existing fighters. This is because the plan to replace 1:1 by Tejas has not materialised. U will soon see that Su 30 MKI will do the job of heavy bomber and fighter and new MRCA will be the work horse supported by Mirage -2000(9) and MiG 29( SMTII) in the future. The induction of Pak FA is for countering the JXX and JSF in the future.By the time PAK FA in inducted.. u will have your J-XX. so just relax.

dear kid just wake up and concentrate on building your nation, i have said India has global ambitions and we are not obssesed by pakistan. We have all this stuff not for pakistan but for china also. china is a big power but we have to keep detterence against it.
As for teaching lesson to others first you must think what you have learnt from past-1965,1971,kargil. I think about 100000 of your soldiers were taken prisoner in 1971 by India and they were used to make roads in India, so your army must be having a good experience in road building and anything else they are not capable to do after having learnt so much.But you are free to do adventures like teaching a lesson to US, Israel and India and you will learn a lot.

Global Ambitions - Let me guess...

1-"AAKUND BAHARAT" ... And let me tell you never gonna happen.
2-"Global Power in spreading ADIS".... Don't worry, you are already there...Wow Wat a ambition, really mind blowing
3-"Best Project Management"....Even military projects like LCA JUST took 25 years,
OK, If you want to get into HISTORY

Actually, it all reflects how dum you indians are really, around 100,000 men were there to tell you how to build a road... but alas you never learned that even ...So we decided to build them at home and we are doing that... [will glad to give u details]
US and Israel- not so clear, but for Indian in Afghanistan... I give a tip - Go to hanuman g and do paratna that US never leave Afghanistan otherwise "WE WILL TEACH indian A LESSON IN AFGHANISTAN"... And that is a promise. Now get the fuxk off

Let me clear you all Pakistani mates that the term Akhund Bharat is used by you very freequently, that we Indians are pretty confident that Pakistan is a sovereign state and for the sake of hell we will never want Pakistan to join us by anyhow, but many of you are not confident of that even, so you use this term so freequently. we will never become friends but we can become stable and normal neighbours. So we wish Pakistan to be a stable democracy. Why you use this term "akhund bharat", i mean nobody in India has the time to think about Pakistan, we are pretty buisy in ourselves and in acheiving our goals. This is a false propaganda to which no Indian gives any consideration.

By the way i wish that all the problems get solved peacefuly but you guys are always talking of teaching a lesson to us and this dream of yours is never going to become true. So, i advise you guys to focus on your internal problems and find solution for those. Teaching a lesson is easier said than done.

One more advise, become more tolerant and less abusive, by abusing any religion or other people you tend to show the structure of your society. Some of you talk like animals but don't know that they are tamed by humans(e.g. US). So. more animine and barbaric you get more of you will be hunted and kept in captivity.

There is nothing like Mig-29 SMTII.

The SMT2 is just a twin seat trainer version of SMT.

The Indian Mig-29 upgrade will be new. It will be upgraded with the features of MKI.

.

not obsessed by Pakistan, but signed up for the Pakistani defence forum eh?

Actually thats a fair enough question...

Why do Indians signup on PDF....??

My Reasoning would say:

Defence is always a relative term. One cannot talk about it keeping the system opposing it in picture. However doing it yourself might lead to biased judgement. On the other hand, if one pits its resources to the inspection and comments of knowledgable persons on the other side...there is a lot of chances for some real development of thought on both side.

Knowledge and Humbleness are virtues that are omni-present be it at this side or the other side of the line. It also depends who you engage. In the process you learn more about yourself which you might not have learnt all alone.

Beautifull thing yeah man...??



I hope someday i got to choose am Indian Flag as well to go beside the Pakistan Flag....thanks

i joined to know what the people on the other side of fence think of these issues, i have joined other forums too so i am not talking at this forum only. Infact you people should join other forums too including Indian forums. I can see that only a few Pakistani guys talk here and that too with a long respone time?

So far your post has been civil, so i will not respond like i usually do with your kind. This is our forum, whether we abuse, or are intolerant, its our will and here we do what we want. You do not see a Pakistani bad mouthing anyone on other forums, but i've seen many of your kind on SDF, WAB, Defence Talk, Iranian, Afghan and other forums. Bad mouthing us Pakistanis and our country. I also remember the way your kind behaved right after 9/11, oh yeah, i was in New York and i witnessed how your pathetic kind jumped the bandwagon with the white/black americans in bashing muslims. And as if that wasn't enough, bashing Pakistanis in particular was ever present.

I know your kind very well, i've taken on your kind fist for fist in the open and have come out with my knuckles stained with their blood. Your kind isn't to be trusted, nor is to befriend. However having said that, I always encourage peace amongst our two nations. Peace should not be MISTAKEN with friendship or gettin all yuppie with your skanky actresses coming to our country. Peace is for you and your kind to live on your side and do not BUG us and stay the &@!% out of our affairs.

As for us being hunted & kept in captivity ...... huh .... boy, the lemme give a little history lesson .... the Greeks came and bypassed us only to conquer your kind, the Mongols came and regretted ever destroying Baghdad, we plundered your lands seventeen times, those snorting p|g-Brits came, fought, got bit©hslapped and then ended up signing a truce with us, then the Russians came and they got the bloodiest nose they would remember for a life time .... this time around those yankies are here .... and if they'd know any better, then they will catch their tail between their legs and run home to mommy.

Last time i checked, the ones you so confidently say will tame us, are right now shitting in their pants with their economy running into a brick wall. Lemme give you a glimpse into the future ..... your daddy, America will crumble under its hyper economy as China usurps all that comes its way, and your other daddy, Britain when realizes that American economy is on the verge of a collapse, will start shittin as well .....

In the end, those who you claim so arrogantly that they will tame us or put us in captivity ...... forget that our kind would not bow to any man, succumb to any mortal. You're most welcome to try, but that is all you can do ... boy.

Actually only our Navy is ahead while Army and Air Force are way behind...for example...The current list of PAF and IAF....(only 4th generation fighters)...

PAF:

36 F-16 Block 50
40 J-10
150 JF-17

IAF:

100 PAK FA
230 SU-30 MKI
126 MRCA
100 Jaguar DARIN-II
50 Mirage 2009
80 Mig-29SMT
200 LCA

(not mentioned old fighters like Mig-27 upg, Mig-21 Bison, Mirage Rose, F-7PG etc)

But here you should note that India also have to take care of China in the North, when China have to take care of Japan, Korea, Taiwan and US in the East. So it is just a balance, nothing to worry....As you say J-10 is better than SU-30 MKI, so you dont need to count them because a superior fighter always win.

Looks like a fishing expedition by joseph.

Over 10 billion arms acquired by Pakistan (NOT PLANS as Bhindeees do) at MNNA at 30% market value from US. I am sure they are designed to put a good dent in Bhindia BS procurements. So relax, they will face a good "dewali".

sfhussain

nice post...