Can anyone tell me about Project 2 or Branch 2 the PAK navy moving some P3 and the Agosta 90B to a Strategic Forces command???
And What is the latest on the German 214 contract or is PN now looking at China for the next submarine or both...????
Full Version: Project 2
Greetings
Can anyone tell me about Project 2 or Branch 2 the PAK navy moving some P3 and the Agosta 90B to a Strategic Forces command???
And What is the latest on the German 214 contract or is PN now looking at China for the next submarine or both...????
Can anyone tell me about Project 2 or Branch 2 the PAK navy moving some P3 and the Agosta 90B to a Strategic Forces command???
And What is the latest on the German 214 contract or is PN now looking at China for the next submarine or both...????
QUOTE(Bones @ Mar 5 2008, 08:56 PM) 
Greetings
Can anyone tell me about Project 2 or Branch 2 the PAK navy moving some P3 and the Agosta 90B to a Strategic Forces command???
And What is the latest on the German 214 contract or is PN now looking at China for the next submarine or both...????
Can anyone tell me about Project 2 or Branch 2 the PAK navy moving some P3 and the Agosta 90B to a Strategic Forces command???
And What is the latest on the German 214 contract or is PN now looking at China for the next submarine or both...????
The U214 deal with Germany might be signed after IDEAS 2008...we'll find out by then. I think the PN will stick to just 3 Type-214s and focus more on a future SSK as a local initiative with foreign assistance from China, France or Germany. It would be a better investment for the long-term...it could be designed for future requirements and enter production in the early 2020s...eventually it could form the bulk of our SSK fleet.
Regarding Strategic Forces Command...I think it is supposed to entail nuclear-equipped or nuclear armed systems? Some interesting stuff from PakDef's Rafi.
QUOTE
I think our SSN project can go two possible ways ie 1) The suggestion that we make a light SSN (about 4000-4500 tons).
2) Or try to make a more traditional type of SSN (much much heavier) this will need much more help from foreign sources.
This all depends on how far the minature reactor research has got, all I can say on a public forum, is at the highest level (top brass) have decided that the strategic future of Pakistan nuclear detterent lies with this technology. The last strategic force to be set up was the Navy Strategic Force Command but unlike the Army (Babur, Shaheen II etc) Airforce Mirage III, V (bombs, ALCM stand off PM).
The most secretive and elusive is the navys role, my guess is any project to deploy nuclear weapons on subs or SSN project will be highly classified, all I can say is Inshallah the nation will rise to the occassion.
2) Or try to make a more traditional type of SSN (much much heavier) this will need much more help from foreign sources.
This all depends on how far the minature reactor research has got, all I can say on a public forum, is at the highest level (top brass) have decided that the strategic future of Pakistan nuclear detterent lies with this technology. The last strategic force to be set up was the Navy Strategic Force Command but unlike the Army (Babur, Shaheen II etc) Airforce Mirage III, V (bombs, ALCM stand off PM).
The most secretive and elusive is the navys role, my guess is any project to deploy nuclear weapons on subs or SSN project will be highly classified, all I can say is Inshallah the nation will rise to the occassion.
http://www.pakdef.info/forum/showpost.php?...mp;postcount=78
Thus far it appears the Strategic Forces Command would entail nuclear-capable/equipped assets...thus far there isn't much known about PN. According to Rafi though...a 1500+ km turbofan equipped Babur cruise missiles & nuclear powered submarines are on the development cards. I imagine we may soon hear about a SCF-C4I involving satellites, new AWACS and a exclusive data-link set-up...
A 1500+ turbofan equipped Babur cruise missile should not be much harder now. Since Shorter lifetime requirements means that we can relatively easily get good performance from a turbofan engine, as we can allow it to run at higher thermodynamic efficiencies requiring higher operating temperatures (the higher the internal temperatur of an engine in comparison to surrounding temperature, the more efficient it is, but it will also wear off quickly as well). However, for longer range requirments we may take some time to overcome possible aero-elastic instabilities in compressor and/or turbine etc (meaning as turbulent air passes, the engine compressor and turbine blades and attachements vibrate which can increase over time as result of interaction with further incomming air leading to structural failure )as well in designing associated coupled rotor system which must have stringent requirements in terms of mechanical instabilities (i.e. bending, or torsional vibrations etc which can again lead to engine breaking up eventually or working with lessor peformance and overtime degration structurally).
Overall airframe design should not be difficult. I think main problem could be guidance in absence of detailed 3D maps of Indian territories, since full reliance on GPS or known coordinates of the target with possible photographs and as well as important terrain features along the way would be risky. This is because GPS is increasingly vulnerable not just to jamming but we can replicate false GPS signals just as easily. Further detection of terrain features while perfectly possible, increasing probability of detection and correct match means higher resolution image processing with possible 3D geometry re-construction algorithms to help in feature matching, all requiring high density dedicated multi-media chips.
While Pakistan is now increasingly writing sophisticated software for multi-media applications (i.e. software centers in Lahore, Karachi for embedded software for mobile phones), and dedicated chip design increasingly is common place with now many universities even involved in designing chips at the semiconductor level (i.e. Punjab university, UET Lahore), we still would require time to design a robust video processing chip.
So in all outlook is good for advanced Babur at least in technical terms, with funding being the main hurdle.
Overall airframe design should not be difficult. I think main problem could be guidance in absence of detailed 3D maps of Indian territories, since full reliance on GPS or known coordinates of the target with possible photographs and as well as important terrain features along the way would be risky. This is because GPS is increasingly vulnerable not just to jamming but we can replicate false GPS signals just as easily. Further detection of terrain features while perfectly possible, increasing probability of detection and correct match means higher resolution image processing with possible 3D geometry re-construction algorithms to help in feature matching, all requiring high density dedicated multi-media chips.
While Pakistan is now increasingly writing sophisticated software for multi-media applications (i.e. software centers in Lahore, Karachi for embedded software for mobile phones), and dedicated chip design increasingly is common place with now many universities even involved in designing chips at the semiconductor level (i.e. Punjab university, UET Lahore), we still would require time to design a robust video processing chip.
So in all outlook is good for advanced Babur at least in technical terms, with funding being the main hurdle.
^^^
The 3d imagery and maps of Indian territory shouldnt be a problem at all. In a report to congress on cruise missile proliferation Pakistan was listed as a country with this capability in mature form and this was in 90s. Then our Mirages which were upgraded under ROSE program have digital scene matching as part of MAESTRO nav/attack capability. This depends on digital imagery database.
The 3d imagery and maps of Indian territory shouldnt be a problem at all. In a report to congress on cruise missile proliferation Pakistan was listed as a country with this capability in mature form and this was in 90s. Then our Mirages which were upgraded under ROSE program have digital scene matching as part of MAESTRO nav/attack capability. This depends on digital imagery database.
QUOTE(maglomanic @ Mar 24 2008, 10:10 PM)
^^^
The 3d imagery and maps of Indian territory shouldnt be a problem at all. In a report to congress on cruise missile proliferation Pakistan was listed as a country with this capability in mature form and this was in 90s. Then our Mirages which were upgraded under ROSE program have digital scene matching as part of MAESTRO nav/attack capability. This depends on digital imagery database.
The 3d imagery and maps of Indian territory shouldnt be a problem at all. In a report to congress on cruise missile proliferation Pakistan was listed as a country with this capability in mature form and this was in 90s. Then our Mirages which were upgraded under ROSE program have digital scene matching as part of MAESTRO nav/attack capability. This depends on digital imagery database.
That would be a big help, since we cannot guide safely and soundly by using other means, they are too risky. I think that must have been done by suparco since they have international agreements (i.e. spot satellite) to obtain data from imaging satellites. In anycase, our own RSSS program is underway, so we will be able to feed real time imagery since as buildings or installation can be camoflauged, which will create confusion in image detection algorithms and may lead to a miss.
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QUOTE(cyberdyn @ Mar 25 2008, 02:21 AM)
That would be a big help, since we cannot guide safely and soundly by using other means, they are too risky. I think that must have been done by suparco since they have international agreements (i.e. spot satellite) to obtain data from imaging satellites. In anycase, our own RSSS program is underway, so we will be able to feed real time imagery since as buildings or installation can be camoflauged, which will create confusion in image detection algorithms and may lead to a miss.
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Can you please shed some light on RSSS? Never heard of it before.
QUOTE(maglomanic @ Mar 25 2008, 08:55 AM)
Can you please shed some light on RSSS? Never heard of it before.
bro, will talk about it in a week or two (I am packing up to leave soon), but you can go to "suparco.gov.pk" to see some detail there under "major programs", since they are basically executing it. Some components are being designed by suparco engineer and some will be in JVs as feaseability studies nears compeletion.
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