Venezuela to buy Chinese K-8 planes CARACAS, May 12 (Reuters/AFP): Venezuelan will buy Chinese military training planes, further cementing a growing relationship with China. Venezuela and China on Friday signed an accord to build a refinery on Chinese soil. “We're going to buy Chinese K-8 planes,” Chavez said during his weekly Sunday broadcast, calling them “excellent planes for the boys.”
Chavez to sign $2 billion mly deals in Moscow: MOSCOW: Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez will buy military equipment worth nearly two billion dollars during a visit to Russia at the end of the month, Russian newspaper Kommersant reported Monday. Venezuela is to buy 10 Russian-made Ilyushin 76MD-90 military cargo aircraft, two Ilyushin-78MK tankers, up to 10 Mi-28NE Night Hunter attack helicopters, as well as four Russian Type 636 attack submarines, said Kommersant.

How much of the K-8 does Pakistan make?
Does anyone know how much the K-8 costs?

Does this mean that this is a footstep into the South American market also or does this mean only China will benefit from this?

Great news it will also pave the way for Thunder going in that part of globe as well

Woot, its a joint venture so half the profits will flow to us

Great, hope this will strengthen South Amercian and Pakistani ties too in the long run.

How many planes?

K8 has turned out to be a great jet trainer!

How much does 1 k-8 cost?

around 15-20 million i guess. Currentlly 12 countries are operating K-8.

K8 has turned out to be a great jet trainer!

It is one of the best success stories of Pak / China collaboration.

They are gearing themself up, but for what ? JF-17 will be perfect for them I believe ....

Regional power in South America. Probably never any military conflict, but diplomatically things sometimes get hot in the area

They are gearing themself up, but for what ? JF-17 will be perfect for them I believe ....

Firstly we need the JF-17 first but also it is not yet a proven platform let alone fully loaded up.

K-8 is something like 10 to 15 year old platform.

As they say for JF-17 ; jaaani aagay aagay dekho hota hay kiya !! Great future for FC-1 / JF-17 for sure. It is a platform without any strings attached !

I hope they buy JF-17...

According to some Chinese forum there have been 500 K-8 produced so far with about half exported. That is quite a succesful program. Insha Allah the JF-17 will also reap the same success.

Good news conratulations to everyone.


SPEEDY
enjoy

CONGRATULATIONS BRETHREN

costs are between 5-7 million a piece.

are you sure about that? I saw that somewhere also but it doesnt make sense because you can pretty much buy a fully loaded JF-17 with that price instead of a trainer.

Munir Posted Today, 02:15 PM
costs are between 5-7 million a piece.

Can you please give me a link for that please, i just want to be sure. Also does Pakistan own 50% of the K-8? I remember reading somewhere 25%.

The K8 is Chinese NOT Pakistani. Pakistan merely makes parts of the K8 under licence. Even that has been reduced in the past year.

"The $20 million K-8 advanced jet trainer has been jointly designed and produced by the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC), Kamra and China's Nanchang Aircraft Manufacturing Company (NAMC) and is manufactured at NAMC."
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/DefencePro...nufacturing.htm

"Unit Cost: US $20 million" http://www.paktribune.com/exclusive/exclus...tails.php?id=70

perhaps I understood it wrongly? Does that mean the development cost instead of the cost of aircraft itself? I believe that Munir is right, because JL-15 will only cost around 15 million. 20 million for a k-8 does sound too high

The Hongdu JL-8 (or Nanchang JL-8 and K-8 Karokorum) is a two-seat basic trainer and light attack aircraft built in joint-cooperation between Pakistan (Pakistan Aeronautical Complex) and the People's Republic of China (China Nanchang Aircraft Manufacturing Corporation). The contractor for this plane is the Hongdu Aviation Industry Corporation. Export versions are designated K-8 Karakorum, after the mountain range that separates China and Pakistan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K-8_Karakorum

The K-8 Karakorum basic jet trainer aircraft was jointly developed by Nanchang-based Hongdu Aviation Industry Group (HAIG) and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) in the 1990s as a successor to the Cessna T-37 jet trainers in the Pakistani Air Force service.

http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/trainer/jl8.asp

I think the K-8's unit cost at less than $10mn sounds more than reasonable as the JF-17 will be marketed at less than $20mn.

the egyptian k-8E's unit cost is 3~3.5 million each.
http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/traine...reign-sales.asp

$30mn is steep for JF-17. $25mn sounds right, the only reason the F-17 is gonna go down to 15-20mn is because Pakistan itself might purchase 200-250 F-17, if over 500 K-8 have been sold then the price for each one should have came down also right?
$15-20mn for k-8 just sounds rediculous

That's exactly what I said.......

Alhamdu'lillah.
Fantastic news (I wasn't expecting this).

Its too early to export jf-17. its still a half cooked dish. Unless it gets 100% certified as a good platform in service and every little problem is ironed out and settled, exporting will be a bad marketing act.

mr moderator, no plane is ironed out that much. Let us take F18. You know that they added some wings to avoid cracks? It is about getting certification. Complex machines are tested and tested and improved. They try to avoid big mistakes. Even that is a risk.

oye chachay, jf is still not at the stage where we can say that "ok done. we have completed it and and now nothing else is needed to be done and nothing out of ordinary will come out".

The point is lets get our plane in such a condition that we can say yes its trust worthy design. Otherwise other buyers will end up saying " kay maseebat jaan noo paa le hay".



Really. Tell me again which plane was exported before even having it for atleast 6 months? (again exported and not given to its partners.)

The planes that are specifically made on orders are different stories as no one wants them to be tested but in all other instances, Your flagship plane is always tested in service by yourself and then handed over to others just to make sure that it shouldnt spend more time in hanger missing a nut or bolt that was thought not to be necessary. Cause at the end of day, it will always be the first exported plane which will decide the fate of future exports. Oh and by the way, a single problem in firt batch of exported jf will means a marketing disaster. you dont want your first ever "original" plane have the bad publicity.


why the hostility man. did i step on your tail :)

Venezuela are buying 24 of these:

Venezuela would probably be going for the K-8P with the updated HUD and MFD system that is available in the K-8P only. Any info on this? and pakistan has 20 of them!!!

K-8P is still on the drawing board. Talks are going on with chinese officials for the upgradation.

The above news is in chinese but it clearly states Pakistan has recieved 1st batch of K-8P from China i dont understand what makes you say its on the drawing board since i have seen news which says other wise.

Naaa, nobody here can step on my tail :)

It would be saying K-8, not the K-8P.

otherwise iam wrong maybe. ill also try to confirm it.

i dont know where do you get your info from my dear airomerix. but the PAF Academy has been running the K-8P since long. It has graduated 10 Fighter Conversion Courses on this weapon system. and now its procuring new 20 K-8P. anyone knowning when we will be getting these birds?????

SOON.... maybe that was help ful

I just hope our guys can get their hands on these babies. i hear the rate of roll of K-8 aircraft is really fast and you just need some input on these guys.

Its stated in Airforces Monthly tht a lot of African and South American nations are going to replace their vintage aircraft (usually older generation hand-me-downs)in coming years, and as they cant buy the costly new gen airplanes, ONLY the JF-17 is the currently available option for a sophisticated yet comparitively cheap aircraft plus no possibilities of sanctions, tht they can field, and come up to pace with other nations.

I read somewhere that Venezuela is in the process of buying or is atleast interested in buying fighter planes from Russia. I doubt it we would be selling any JF-17 Thunders this decade to any other country, we don't even have enough for ourselves at the moment - only eight so far.

JF-17 production is just getting started. Assembly in Pakistan has just been set up. By the end of 2008 you'll be seeing 2 JF-17's being pumped out every month. And China has always been very fast in delivering arms to everyone. So you can bet that Zimbabwe's order of 12 aircraft will start shipment within the decade. Also, Azerbaijan is about to confirm soon.

Once Pakistan's first JF-17 squadron (16 aircraft) is complete, in 2009, I'm guessing Pakistan's assembly facilities will be deciated to PAF, while the facilities in China will focus on exports to other countries.

The serial production of JF-17 has started in PAC Kamra from 2nd April.

Source: Wikipedia.......
Current operators
Egypt
Egyptian Air Force - 80 + 40 to be assembled in Egypt
Ghana
Ghana Air Force - 4
Myanmar
Myanmar Armed Forces - 12
Namibia
Namibian Air Force - 4
Pakistan
Pakistan Air Force - 100 + 20 being produced
People's Republic of China
PLA Air Force - 200
Sri Lanka
Sri Lanka Air Force - 4
Sudan
Sudanese Air Force - 12
Zambia
Zambian Defence Force - 8
Zimbabwe
Air Force of Zimbabwe - 12

Potential customers
Indonesia
China has offered the K-8 as a replacement for the Indonesian Hawk Mk.53. Indonesia has not decided yet.
Venezuela
Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has mentioned in May 2008 that Venezuela planned to purchase K-8 planes (unspecified number)24.

Venezuela should be offerd Mushaq, K8, JF17 and a decent Chinese AWACS... Nice package for oil swap.

I think it's a good idea...part of the deal could cover wages & material, while the rest is covered with oil.

They wouldn't put all their apples in one bucket.

a very simple question,
what benefit does Pakistan get when K8 is sold to anyone.

They have share of the profit. They wil sell some spare parts that are produced in Pakistan. They will probably able to deal with training and maintentance... A lot more then most think.

Munir,
is this confirmed or just a dream.

supporting for maintenance is good, it gives us experience and money to keep extra engineering people

Atleast they can while negotating with Pakistan. It is the US which alarms the most!

Like munir said, Pakistan gets 50% of profits.

Profits of course is only the bottom line. For example if we sell K-8 for $10 and then Chinese manufacturers charge $8 for diff parts, so the $2 profit will be split 50/50 between china and pakistan. But inside that $8 chinese manufacturers are probably making some profits, which makes sense since China makes most of the plane.

With JF-17 this will be more balanced as Pakistan heading towards 50% of the plane.