Pakistan army head in Kabul after Musharraf goes

By KATHY GANNON, Associated Press Writer


37 minutes ago



KABUL, Afghanistan - Pakistani army chief Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani rushed to Kabul on Tuesday for meetings, Afghan officials said, the day after Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf announced his resignation.

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Kayani was to meet with Afghan Defense Minister Gen. Rahim Wardak, and he spoke with President Hamid Karzai over the phone in Kabul on Tuesday, three officials told The Associated Press.

Kayani's visit was striking in that even Afghanistan's top leadership did not know he planned to visit, officials said. Top aides inside the presidential palace and Defense Ministry said that they were unaware Kayani was in Kabul even after he arrived.

Kayani was also likely to meet with the commander of NATO forces in Afghanistan, Gen. David McKiernan, though NATO officials would not immediately confirm that.

The Afghan officials spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitive nature of the visit.

The visit comes only 24 hours after Musharraf — who once held Kayani's position as army chief before resigning last fall — announced his resignation.

Musharraf was Washington's key ally in the fight against insurgents on the Afghan-Pakistan border. His resignation pressures Pakistan's newly elected government to provide new leadership in the country's fight against militants.

NATO officials say militants seek safe haven in Pakistan's tribal areas where they train and rearm.

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Associated Press writers Jason Straziuso and Amir Shah contributed to this report from Kabul


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080819/ap_on_...cakrfiWGG39xg8F

New commanders new masters.

Sounds suspicious... Remember when the Americans praised Kayani over the moon when he got appointed as COAS? Trust me, when the Americans start praising someone there's usually something deeply wrong.

What is he doing there ???


I am now all very much confuse as its realy strange that for the first time our COAS is visiting Kabul.

Earlier as NATO/US need us so their commanders used to visit us we never went to them.


Whats going on ???

we must wait and see....

It is too early to say anything with authenticity at this moment. I do hope that he is there to tell NATO and Afghans that we will tackle Terrorists in our on way and first thing he must tell Yanks is that Pakistan is going to fence and mine our border so that we can stop Indian sponsored nothren alliance terrorists.

I will again say...Let see, what is out come of this visit.

we must wait and see....

It is too early to say anything with authenticity at this moment. I do hope that he is there to tell NATO and Afghans that we will tackle Terrorists in our on way and first thing he must tell Yanks is that Pakistan is going to fence and mine our border so that we can stop Indian sponsored nothren alliance terrorists.

I will again say...Let see, what is out come of this visit.

I would like to take at your understand.

Maybe say, now see we want a fresh start. No more unprovoked attacks on us. PA has been bombing the manics daily and we don't want any predators firing missiles on us + no more media blitz against us. We have a new setup .. we need your support at the crucial time .. & please no more suicide bombing in our area !

You guys must be smoking something strong if you think that our beleagured army chief goes to enemy territory to tell them what they should do. It doesn't work that way in international relations. Heads of state may do that but not army chiefs.

When a country's army chief goes like this it is because HE wants to avoid something. In this case, we know that given our budget situation, we need continuing US aid to keep our military goals on track. US finally approved the support for F-16 purchases.

Most likely we will see some "arresting" of Taliban commanders soon after Gen. Kayani returns. Gen sahib needs to deliver something to keep the aid flowing.

You're correct to a certain extent. Pakistan army has its own goals and justifiably so. However, these shouldn't undermine the goals of the state. Our lives most certainly don't depend on the delivery of the F-16s. Our lives also don't depend on financial aid or at least shouldn't. Now that the Musharraf era has passed, the current leadership ought to (in an ideal world) make tough decisions internally and unified on issues such as the WoT. What is in the best interest of Pakistan? Do we want to receive financial and military aid at the cost of creating havoc within our own borders? Do we want to allow the Americans and their drones to infiltrate our borders and fire hellfire missiles at our own innocent people in return for aid? Do we want to be harassed and pressured to do more in the WoT? Do we want to loose more lives of our soldiers in the WoT? Do want to be maligned and humiliated about where the aid money is being spent? Do we want to comply to every ridiculous demand of the US/NATO since we're receiving aid with strings attached? Do we want to expand our trade or do we want to live forever in the shackles of aid? Would we want pathetic Afghans to be hostile towards our nation? Do we want to bow down after being pressured not to build, fence and mine our own borders with pathetic Afghanistan? Do we want to fight the Taliban and Al-Qaeda (which by the way indeed form a threat) on our own terms or dictated terms? The question is do we want to be in control of our own destiny? Be rest assured, one cannot be in control of anything unless the horrible shackles of aid are released. An aid recipient is a synonym for being a slave. Period. I hope our respected COAS realizes this. Musharraf should be an example for everyone.

things will be clearer within days.
but, something is certainly cooking.

NATO and the likes are prone to a weekly visit to Islamabad, demanding more needs to be done, in reality we should have been the ones with the list, hence don't come to us.......we will visit you!

Hmm, this is interesting. Don't forget that he was the head of the ISI and is known as one of the best spy masters in the world. His visit could be related to anything not just the Military.

it was a brief stay he was back within few hours

My hunch is he went to tell Karzai "we can be friends"

Pakistan army is in a demoralized state because of the infighting.

He went to secure a deal with Karzai, to tone down his rhetoric against Pakistan.

He probably also blamed alot of the problems on Musharraf, and assured Karzai that things would be different between Kabul and Islamabad now Musharraf era is over.

Thats my guess.

We will find out if it was true if Karzai reduces the venom he spits against Pakistan for all his troubles.

I agree with Sardar.
lol @ people who think he went there to deliver an ultimatum to NATO's pet.

after big change in our country this visit is very very inportant


Gen Kiyani approch is very good, so very helpfull for Pakistan peopel
as well as Pak Army.

In other words ji huzoor, abhi aaya! aur farmaaye kya chahiye kya doon.

Its futile seeing any sort of improvement or victory in Pakistan's strategic or global standing after Musharraf's departure. It is bound to decline , perhaps dramatically, because Musharraf had placed Pakistan in the best place and scenario possible given the very tight situation (unless Pakistan is willing to sacrifice itself for al-Qaida). I wouldnt be saying it if I hadnt considered other alternatives and courses.

Kayani has to cut his own deal with the Americans.

The more Pakistan's economy sinks the further into America's arms Kayani and the Pakistan Army are driven. If Kayani even displeases the Americans a slight bit Zardari and his side-kick President will try to replace Kayani with a crony Chief of Army Staff. How about COAS Bilawal Zardari?

Do you see? It's Kayani's turn to try to save his job by making the Americans happy.

Well a bad choice. Now i had started feeling how strong this time the CIA move is.

They are going to have a president of their choice and would replace Kiyani with own man.

Too bad Kiyani while trying to be a good man respecting the democracy did not see that it could have a disasterous result for the ISI, Army and resultantly the country will be gone.

Americans have thrown this ball and strategy not to save the job of one man Kiyani when they have more important players like zardari in under their foot.

They have invested to this day for getting Pakistani nukes and it seems the task is becoming easier for them.

Guys! Please don't under estimate ISI and Army so easily... I know both these institutions are facing their toughest time in history, I will call it a real test. But those who thing that it was Musharraf who was only savior of this nation are wrong. Definitely, Kiyani knows his limits...he would also know the limits of NATO and this time around he has backing of an elected govt. His visit must be with consent of rest of commanders and after briefings from sector commanders from FATA and NWFP.

If Pak Army has its limitations so is case with NATO as well. They are defendant on us big time... Pakistan can use this card plus the evidences that northern alliance terrorists are there in side Pakistan doing damage to public properties and creating law and order issues... Once we convince NATO on this they will understand our problems and if a man like Nawaz Sharif can take stance in front of Richrad Boucher, Kiyani is far more proper person to do that.

SAVING HIS JOB:- Last time I checked Gen. Musharraf was one who tried to save his job while going blinding into WoT and failed miserably in front of local people and media.

Not quite, although the departure of Musharraf has left a big vacum and Pakistan in a vunerable position, but General Kiyani is upbeat in restoring the moral and dignity of the army, hence the message he will be delivering to NATO and the likes one assumes will be, "you can throw your weight and pressure on all the rats flocking into the national assemblies, but when it comes to incursions and intrusions, you will be dealing with me"!!!

I wonder how long he will remain COAS? A year or two. He is afterall Musharraf's chosen successor.

If he wants to send that message, he does not need to visit Kabul first. Guns do the talking first.
I am really surprised, how anyone can think constraints that were on Musharraf are not on Kayani. The same situation applies to Kayani. Kayani does not have much movement space, except to compromise more.

I am waiting for my CJ to rise first.

Musharraf had a huge disadvantage of not being an elected administrator of country. Whereas Kiyani is a very different story altogether and yanki know if they press Kiyani more and more he can quit by resigning and join the pressure group of Ex-Service men (which I think was raised purposefully) to tell public more about US sinister design. This is a huge difference; Now actual game is on politicians and it is yet to seen that what they do and if they are any well wishers of their own they must bring this WoT in parliament and only parliament is one institute that can save us.

General kiyani is anyways getting retired in early 2010 so he has less than 2 years left.Why would anyone want him to be kicked??

For fuc*k sake, when will you guys start thinking straight and realise that Mr Musharaf and Kiyani and some other top brass in the military has already sold our country and our people???

Can't you read between the lines for God's sake?? Let me tell you in strainght words so that there is no confusion:

That moron Musharaf implemented American and CIA agenda since he took over!! And no one stopped him cause Kiyani and others were also involved in the deal. The Generals who opposed these traitors were sidelined!!

Do you really want to know where the country is heading??? Go to a freaking Utility store in Pakistan and SEE HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE STANDING IN A QUE TO GET WHEAT AND OTHER COMMODITIES BECAUSE IN OTHER SHOPS THESE ITEMS HAVE GONE THROUGH THE ROOF!!

So get you heads out of your freaking arses and understand that the country is in the greatest danger ever unless someone does something about it!!

There's an interview of Hamid Gul on Asia Times which sheds some light on this issue:

for my unexperienced youth, who don't know anything but Moshe...............here is the letter that put Javed Hashmi behind bars.
sorry to say many out of you can't even read urdu, and try to be Mufakar e Pakistan.

Fellows, seriously the more I analyse the situation the more frightening it becomes!! I am absolutely terrified to think what have these few people done to this country and to its people!! I just cannot stop shaking my head in disbelief!!

Our country was on the verge of becoming great just a few years back, and now it is fast pacing towards disintegration and chaos!! Words cannot describe what our people will face in a few months time!!

If Kiyani went to kabul without informing the PM, just hang him...as it already means that he is on the run.

Thats the thing .... you didn't see the days of Nawaz or BB.

For God's sake ... try to understand something basic ... Nawaz ransacked the very Supreme Court that he pretends to care for today. BB got her brother killed to keep him from the family kingdom called Bhuttoistan.

nawaz did it once, Moshe did it thrice.
BB killed her bro, moshe killed thousands +BB.
but I still feel, bound in a marriage of convenience, both of these thugs can be far better than our recently outgoing patriot.
anyway, Dear I used to wear Bilawal medal on my Khaki back in eighties

But remember that just a few weeks back the PM gave Kiyani a free hand to deal with Extremists in Pakistan and Afghanistan--so kiyani has an excuse.

However, every person in the country should be very, very concerned as why Kiyani just rushed to a dirt filth country Afghanistan as soon as Musharaf resigned?? There is something very sinister going on!!!

No mate .... lets not compare sending hired goons to taking completely non-violent steps, all of them validated by the parliment & SC.

Unfortunately, nawaz's actions were not validated anywhere.

and why tag BB on mush? unless offcourse you have info that no one dosen't ... and the biggest benefits have gone to Zardari & Nawaz. thats what they always say, just wait to see who gets the most benefit out of it.

And i for one support the actions in FATA, Lal Masjid and bugti. So may be we will have to agree to disagree.

sit back and wait..........we need to live on guessing "who is with us and who is against us".
in the end, who ever wins, turns against us.........
these bastards get hanged, explode in air, go in exile, get bullet in head, resign, but never get balls to tell the truth to nation.

Ayub was Good (pakistan grew faster than Korea & malaysia in those days)
Zia was Good (Finished instability after the 1977 rigged elections)
and Musharaf was Good (7% growth rate + doubled economy + per captia income went form $552 to $1083, i.e. from a small economy to a mediam economy)


Bhutto was Not Good (Idhar Hum Udhar Tum)
Nawaz was not Good (hi-jacked planes + tried to become Ameer Ul Momeneen)
BB was Not Good (Gave lists to india on Khalistan movement, Mr. 10%)

Could it be? Is Gen. Kiyani a mole from the enemy? Did he go to afghanistan to avoid having his meetings and conversations being monitored?!?!

That is a distinct possibility!! Or is he afraid that there is someone in the military who has become more powerful than him??

Well no, wait a minute. Let's read the news again, from Dawn:

Kayani meets Nato, Afghan commanders in Kabul

KABUL, Aug 19: Pakistan’s Chief of the Army Staff Gen Ashfaq Parvez Kayani made a surprise trip to Afghanistan on Tuesday for border security talks with Nato and Afghan commanders, just a day after President Pervez Musharraf announced his resignation.

Gen Kayani spoke with US-installed President Hamid Karzai over the phone in Kabul on Tuesday, three officials told The Associated Press. Gen Kayani’s visit was striking in that even Afghanistan’s top leadership did not know he was coming, officials said.

But Pakistan’s military spokesman, Maj-Gen Athar Abbas said the trip was scheduled at least a month and a half ago and was part of a series of tripartite meetings designed to underpin cross-border cooperation against militants.

Earlier Tuesday, Karzai, in his first public response to Musharraf’s resignation, appealed for a fresh approach to what has often been a troubled relationship between the two neighbours.

“I wish President Musharraf all the best. We have had difficult days together, but also we had good days together. All in all, we had a good relationship,” Karzai told the AP in an interview.

“The most important thing . . . is not personalities. What is important is that we change our expectations and the way we formulate policies to meet those expectations,” he said.

Karzai has been a strident critic of sanctuaries within Pakistan where he says insurgent Taliban and other militants regroup, rearm and train to fight in Afghanistan.—AP

Looks like Kiyani is distinctly talking about a change in strategy from our side? Maybe he is there telling nato and there pet karzai that he will not treat the afghan taliban as the enemy any more or something to that effect. If the afghan govenrment wasn't aware of his visit, maybe that is just incompetance on there part, which is nothing out of the ordinary.

Let's just hope...

I dont undersand, why would he go to Afghanistan to convey this--why he just could not pick up a phone or do video conferencing? We are living in the 21st century and I am sure we don't use Pigeons for communicating anymore.

I do not believe in coincidences--specially when this is done a day after Musharaf resigned!! There is something very, very sinister going on!!

Aray yaar it can't b e that bad yaar. Agar Army kay generals hi bik gaye hoan aur politicians to waysay hee bickay huay hain, then why this secrecy? If all the powers that be are already sold, then just announce it man, that we're going to become America's 51 state or be a part of bhindia or something (nauzubillah to both). But you see what I mean? If everyone is in kahuts with the west then just freakin' say it and surrender everything; GEEZ!!!

Wala hu alim...

GOSH I get SO pissed off at my baybasi sometimes...

you see when you have 350 million maniacs (35% in india voted for RSS/VHP/BJP) wanting to erase pakistan from the face of the earth, and when you have 300 million idiots (americans) who beleive pakistans nukes are now in terrorist hands (mushy is gone), sorrounding pakistan it DOES matter if we get latest technology F16s (to copy) or not, this is indeed a matter of life and death. and strong economy can only come ones you have sovreighnty, and that comes from serius muslce power...

long live ISI, long live Pakistan, long live the king (musharaf)

Brother, we shouldn't indulge in personality worship. By the way, let me clear this up. I'm not anti nor pro anyone and never have been. I try to judge politicians on the basis of their merit and performance which I believe everyone should. Musharraf is a human too made out of flesh and blood. He made mistakes and he paid the price for it.

Of course, having such potent machines wouldn't be that bad. However, we should weigh the pros and cons. I believe that if the F-16s come with too many strings attached that endanger Pakistan's sovereignty, we should call it a day. It's a very simple deal with the Americans. They simply want sovereignty in exchange for aid. I'm not that eager to exchange sovereignty of Pakistan in exchange for aid. My ancestors have paid with their blood for the sovereignty of Pakistan. Besides, we have alternatives such as J-10 that are on equal footing.

In my opinion, General Kiyani has made everything clear as crystal to see for everyone. The Army has made a deal with the Yanks, which I believe involves eliminating the indians as a threat in Baluchistan and in return they have asked Musharraf to leave. Also, it also is an indicator, that PA is now going to fight anyone in our territory who is anti-US and therefore eliminate all possible groups with the name 'Taliban' in their title. Peace deals which have held for this long would be scrapped and there would be more and more participation by the PA & PAF to eliminate these factions, be they Pro-Pakistan or not. Those who are Pro-Pakistan and anti-America, would either be asked to change their stance or tone it down all the way.

ISI would be restrained from holding any activities in Kashmir, Khalistan and Afghanistan. They would pretty much be decapitated and would be rendered ineffective in the coming months or years.

Bro, I think this will be one of the gravest mistakes PA can make!! Isn't this what US wanted anyways--to put ISI in a cage? We are in this position because we have always tried to please US, and if this continues we will be left with nothing.

why paint such a bleak picture brother? it depressed me

Where do you come off spinning tales to massage egos. You are talking in confused mind. You think Kayani's different background has some kind of advantage, and US worried over him. lol .
The chief of army will not and does not travel (to Kabul) to talk tough. If that was the case, a govt would and could send someone junior in army, not the highest ranking officer, or send a high diplomat first. Or even the prime minister himself. But the army chief can not do this.

Missiles fired from Afghanistan killed 8 including foreigners in Waziristan today


hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Tough talk huh

And what Gen. Abi Zaid was doing so many time in Pakistan. Taking dictation from Musharraf and Pakistan Army and last time it was Gen, Mullan to do same....Huh.

PS: Mind your language next time....would you?

Your question is too general and out of context. Lets agree to disagree. Sorry if I offended you.